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Carnivore+Liver=Cured Eczema
Just wondering what people's thoughts are on this guy who healed his eczema while eating a carnivore diet that consisted of lots of eggs, bacon, butter, chicken liver, and beef liver pills?
Him talking about eating eggs+beef liver pills for breakfast:
Him talking about adding chicken liver to his beef patties:
Please keep in mind this isn't an isolated case either. I have seen many reports of people curing psoriasis, acne, eczema, and other autoimmune issues on the carnivore diet and many of them dive into it just blindly thinking liver, butter, eggs, etc. are healthy and eat them while seeing dramatic health improvements.
Personally I think vitamin A can be an issue for people, but over time I have come to the conclusion that it's more about plant food toxins as a whole and not just vitamin A. If it was only vit A then cases like this just wouldn't be possible in my opinion. I also think some people for whatever reason are just more sensitive to certain plant foods than others and as you age any tolerances you do have keep decreasing. So some people can eat lots of tomatoes (or whatever) with no issue while others (like Grant) will have horrible reactions to them. Grant even stated removing onion powder from his diet helped his eyesight which is just another example of plant foods in general causing issues.
With that said it's not JUST plant foods either as I have the most dramatic reaction (above all other foods) to dairy proteins. Skim milk, whey protein, casein protein, greek yogurt, cheese, etc. all cause my spine to feel stiff, cystic acne, stuffy nose, dandruff, and just a general feeling of tiredness. However cream/butter cause very little issues. So there's more to the story than just plants=bad in my opinion. I also have a really bad reaction to caffeine and salt where I get horrible muscle cramps from them (talking about feeling like my muscle is going to rip off the bone pain and worried I seriously injured myself when it's over). I also read an interesting post on reddit a while back where someone on the carnivore diet did not resolve their eczema until they cut out salt.
Well that's my 2 cents and I'd be interested in hearing what others think including Grant if he happens to stumble across this. Thanks.
Carnivore/keto puts people’s bodies in a stressful state and they produce more cortisol which reduces body-wide inflammation.
Unfortunately there can be long-term drawbacks to being in a constant state of ketosis and once you’re out of it symptoms tend to return.
Quote from Tommy on May 27, 2023, 2:08 pmCarnivore/keto puts people’s bodies in a stressful state and they produce more cortisol which reduces body-wide inflammation.
That’s an interesting thought but I’m not sure I buy it. Essentially what you’re saying is the carnivore diet is so bad for you that it appears to be good for you. That doesn’t mean it can’t be true, but to me it’s a bit of a convoluted reason when the simplest answer is it’s just healthier diet.
Also here is a link to some arguments that increased cortisol on Keto diets is actually healthy and maybe a more natural state:
https://twitter.com/KetoCarnivore/status/1483934204111036420
@anon33 another person who don't understand even the most basic human functions? Looks like it.. What exactly you don't understand about the fact that when your body has to constantly pump more and more cortisol to keep blood sugar stable it feels good at first because cortisol is anti inflammatory and gives you this feel of energy. But in a long term you will run into issues because you have chronically activated sympathetic nervous system, you are chronically in mode "fight or flight" ? Where are all those 90yo+ people who were most of their lives on no carb diets? All I see is a bunch of influencers in their 40s, 50s who most of them look really unhealthy. Meanwhile most healthy old people eat basically "peasant foods" like starches with vegetables etc..
Quote from Anon33 on May 27, 2023, 11:19 pmQuote from Tommy on May 27, 2023, 2:08 pmCarnivore/keto puts people’s bodies in a stressful state and they produce more cortisol which reduces body-wide inflammation.
That’s an interesting thought but I’m not sure I buy it. Essentially what you’re saying is the carnivore diet is so bad for you that it appears to be good for you. That doesn’t mean it can’t be true, but to me it’s a bit of a convoluted reason when the simplest answer is it’s just healthier diet.
Also here is a link to some arguments that increased cortisol on Keto diets is actually healthy and maybe a more natural state:
https://twitter.com/KetoCarnivore/status/1483934204111036420
Just giving my thoughts is all, like you asked.
I had a bad personal experience and there are many others.
There are plenty of people who do quite well on keto and have managed to sustain it long-term, but I have noticed that despite this they tend to age faster than many others.
Some of the issues I know of off the top of my head include:
Gallbladder issues
Kidney issues
Electrolyte issues
Thyroid issues
There’s probably a keto expert out there that can explain/debunk all those issues away though.
I've done what he did about 12 years ago and it got rid of my psoriasis. It's higher fat (lamb, cheese, butter), it's very good choline especially the 5 eggs for breakfast. It's good taurine as well. Everything improves bile flow and it looks like his leakiness got fixed quickly enough or wasnt that bad. Beef liver pills are the likely problem in the long term. They are 50 times more vitamin A than eggs. People put liver and eggs in same sentence yet they are the extremes of vitamin A. Liver also has choline. The problem with liver I suspect though is the high copper. Eventually after 4 years my skin problem became a bleeding capillaries problem. So short term I got rid of psoriasis with improved bile flow. But something started the buildup of Vitamin A again. Stress, cortisol as Jiri mentioned, high fat, copper or high vitamin A are the possibles in my case.
I dont agree with eating that way all the time. It helps say for 6 months. I'm much happier now eating a varied diet moderate in fat with plenty of eggs and no liver. And this way I've reversed decades of problems re hair loss and other issues by reducing the Vitamin A and getting it out the liver rather than building it up which is potentially what high fat and high liver does.
I very much agree that keto/carnivore can work amazingly short term. But then when it does not work anymore, its a PITA to reverse the issues because you cant even tolerate much anything else than meat 🙁
I think my gallbladder did suffer from my many years of carnivore. And also I think I accumulated too much vitamin A in my liver.
Quote from Jiří on May 28, 2023, 12:12 am@anon33 another person who don't understand even the most basic human functions? Looks like it.. What exactly you don't understand about the fact that when your body has to constantly pump more and more cortisol to keep blood sugar stable it feels good at first because cortisol is anti inflammatory and gives you this feel of energy. But in a long term you will run into issues because you have chronically activated sympathetic nervous system, you are chronically in mode "fight or flight" ? Where are all those 90yo+ people who were most of their lives on no carb diets? All I see is a bunch of influencers in their 40s, 50s who most of them look really unhealthy. Meanwhile most healthy old people eat basically "peasant foods" like starches with vegetables etc..
Hey Jiri,
It's unfortunate you feel the need to be so rude however I will still try to offer some relevant counter examples to your point here:
Joe Anderson-Almost 60 at the time of this pic eating a carnivore diet for almost 20 years:
Joe's wife Charlene who follows the same diet:
Here is a picture of Dr. McDougall and his wife who advocate eating a high starch vegan diet:
Personally I don't like posting examples like this because people can cherry pick certain examples to support whatever they want, but your assertion that the carnivores you see in their 40's and 50's look unhealthy while older people eating high starch diets don't demands an adequate response.
Quote from Andrew B on May 28, 2023, 1:43 amThe problem with liver I suspect though is the high copper. Eventually after 4 years my skin problem became a bleeding capillaries problem. So short term I got rid of psoriasis with improved bile flow. But something started the buildup of Vitamin A again. Stress, cortisol as Jiri mentioned, high fat, copper or high vitamin A are the possibles in my case.
I dont agree with eating that way all the time. It helps say for 6 months. I'm much happier now eating a varied diet moderate in fat with plenty of eggs and no liver. And this way I've reversed decades of problems re hair loss and other issues by reducing the Vitamin A and getting it out the liver rather than building it up which is potentially what high fat and high liver does.
I want to make it clear that I am not advocating eating liver or even doing a carnivore diet necessarily. I am just using this as an extreme example to highlight that if the issue was just/mainly vitamin A then examples like I posted shouldn't be possible yet I have come across similar stories quite often.
Also I want to touch on one thing I see a lot which is people using very complex reasoning for why something works when we really don't have that in-depth of an understanding of human physiology and how everything ties in together. The human body is such an amazing and complex system it's impossible for anyone to fully understand how everything works together, how individual areas affect other areas, all of the feedback loops, etc. I'm not saying we can't understand anything as we obviously do, but there's also so much we don't know that I think a lot of the time we just need to experiment and look at the end result of the changes we make rather than try to figure out exact mechanisms and use those to guide us. If the carnivore diet (or any diet) makes someone's chronic health issues go away then to me that's a clear indication it's good for them even if people can come up with hypothetical reasons for why it isn't based off lab tests, studies they've read, etc.
I also have a really bad reaction to caffeine and salt where I get horrible muscle cramps from them (talking about feeling like my muscle is going to rip off the bone pain and worried I seriously injured myself when it's over).
Sounds like an electrolyte issue. Might wanna find out if you’ve got a potassium or magnesium deficiency happening:
https://healthcoachkait.com/blog/electrolytes-on-a-carnivore-diet
Personally I think vitamin A can be an issue for people, but over time I have come to the conclusion that it's more about plant food toxins as a whole and not just vitamin A. If it was only vit A then cases like this just wouldn't be possible in my opinion.
Accutane is an effective drug. There are individuals who take it as teens, stop after it clears up their acne, and go on to live their lives relatively free of side-effects. Doesn’t mean accutane isn’t super toxic.
But I agree with you in that I think “the whole” is important to consider. Why are some individuals more susceptible to chronic hypervitaminosis A than others? Maybe, as you’ve concluded, plant toxins are a big problem. Maybe it’s primarily something else (like glyphosate). Maybe it’s a combination of different factors (casein or gluten sensitivity, nutrient deficiencies, dysbiosis, and so on) for different people. Context totally does matter.
Thanks for your post, @anon33! 🙂