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Magnesium Deficiency
Please forgive me but I wasn't sure where to post this. I think it's important and should be considered for whether this Vitamin A toxicity theory holds true.
Name's Nick and I had recently (past 4 years) been committed to carnivore to heal my UC. The diet had worked wonders, however there were slight periods every few months where things would fall backwards - leading to massive flaring and depression etc.
I had recently went through one of these flares, yet this one seemed like it was lasting way longer than it should.
As a coincidence, the podcast with Judy and Grant had aired around this flare-up. So I got thinking about Vitamin A as an issue. I was consuming a lot of dairy and occasional 3oz liver every week. Furthermore, all of my symptoms seemed right in line with Vitamin A toxicity (brain fog, blurry vision at night, uc flare and a strong red rash developing on the tops of my hands, itchy skin and highly irritable).
I cut my Vit A sources immediately and felt some surprising relief within the first 24hrs. Yet by the third day, everything went backwards again.
Out of frustration I tried to go back to as much of a "ground zero" as I could. Scouring the internet and almost losing my mind because of a mess of a rabbit hole I was in...
Then I found an interesting relationship....
Magnesium deficiency leading to autoimmune responses.
Now considering I was consuming some coffee from time to time (black), and how caffeine can prevent the absorption of Magnesium... New things were starting to add up.
So I tested it out. Some Magnesium Glycinate, 50mg doses. After the first dose that forth morning - everything flipped. All of these supposed Vitamin A symptoms were disappearing.
I kept up with dosing (around 200mg a day). Each day since has gotten me back on track.
Just today I tested the next step - had some liver and dairy together in a meal... Not a single negative response.
I'm not trying to debunk the Vitamin A toxicity theory. I just want to help draw better conclusions either way.
I would suggest people give the Magnesium adjust a try. Worst case, there's no improvement over a week or so and you're back to just cutting Vitamin A completely. I think this is more the case if you consume caffeine and other things that can inhibit proper Ma absorption.
Good luck and thank you for your time!
Judging by the timeline of things, this happened quite recently, so I wouldn't put all my money on magnesium as the fix. Give it some time, as I am tempted to think that magnesium is acting for you more so as a symptom alleviator rather than a cure.
Furthermore, coffee alone can't make you magnesium deficient to the point of autoimmunity unless you were chugging liters of it. Also, it's not that it impairs its absorption as much as the fact that it's a diuretic, which can deplete you of any electrolyte or b vitamin.
And for the record, I use magnesium citrate on and off as a supplement, it's pure cope for my issues.
I have had bizarre reactions to magnesium just as I have had bizarre reactions to b vitamins. Which makes me think that probably there is something to your theory. And that possibly getting replete with Mg might very well help, although in my case it is a scary idea.
Quote from lil chick on May 19, 2021, 6:14 amI have had bizarre reactions to magnesium just as I have had bizarre reactions to b vitamins. Which makes me think that probably there is something to your theory. And that possibly getting replete with Mg might very well help, although in my case it is a scary idea.
How long did the bizarre reactions last? Often if I make some major change to the diet, with supplements etc,, there can be a couple days of mysterious lumps, rashes, sleep disruption and odd "stool". But always clears up within a week. An RBTI naturopath, Challen Waychoff, told me this is normal whenever your body chemistry is shifting.
magnesium supplements make immune system very low running; imagine y'd contracting covid(knock on wood) in context of magnesium supplements this could lead to disaster
How on earth did you come to that conclusion?
Presumably you're referencing this paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0925443900000181?via%3Dihub
The abstract clearly states that magnesium deficiency led to an allergy-like inflammatory immune response in short order. How is that desirable? Not only do we not want an inflammatory response in the absence of an infectious agent, but oftentimes the inflammatory immune response to an infectious agent does more damage than the agent itself (e.g. cytokine storm).
Immune system(cytokines) does more damage as a direct result of its initial laziness and hypo-responsiveness.
Magnesium downregulates signaling pathways -> immune systems kicks in when its too late -> cytokine storm -> damage.
You'll not be getting either magnesium defficiency nor inflammatory response in the absence of immune system triggers - remember healthy people do not care of their mangesium intake(as well as other minerals or vitamins) nor they get any symptoms when trying diets low in magnesium like carnovire, etc..
I think it's likely that insulin resistance and not lack of enough magnesium in the diet is the main reason for magnesium deficiency symptoms. Many with magnesium deficiency symptoms report having to take large amounts each day to ease symptoms. This indicates lack of absorption and taking large amounts daily will create imbalances in the body.
Best way to improve insulin sensitivity is to do some intense exercise daily. Most of us don't exercise enough. I don't recommend jogging or cycling though. I personally like boxing, sprints and calisthenics.
Quote from rockarolla on May 20, 2021, 10:44 amImmune system(cytokines) does more damage as a direct result of its initial laziness and hypo-responsiveness.
Magnesium downregulates signaling pathways -> immune systems kicks in when its too late -> cytokine storm -> damage.
You'll not be getting either magnesium defficiency nor inflammatory response in the absence of immune system triggers - remember healthy people do not care of their mangesium intake(as well as other minerals or vitamins) nor they get any symptoms when trying diets low in magnesium like carnovire, etc..
Just because someone is healthy today with an insufficient magnesium intake, that doesn't mean they are going to be healthy in the future. Chronic deficiencies ( & toxicities) can take years or even decades to manifest as chronic disease. Nutrient mineral deficiencies also cause the body to retain toxic minerals which have similar properties in the periodic table, in an attempt to maintain balance.
Hence: Deficiency of magnesium and/or silica causes retention of aluminium,
Deficiency of calcium causes retention of lead,
Deficiency of zinc causes retention of cadmium,
Deficiency of selenium causes retention of mercury, etc.
Quote from Moebius on May 19, 2021, 1:28 pmQuote from lil chick on May 19, 2021, 6:14 amI have had bizarre reactions to magnesium just as I have had bizarre reactions to b vitamins. Which makes me think that probably there is something to your theory. And that possibly getting replete with Mg might very well help, although in my case it is a scary idea.
How long did the bizarre reactions last? Often if I make some major change to the diet, with supplements etc,, there can be a couple days of mysterious lumps, rashes, sleep disruption and odd "stool". But always clears up within a week. An RBTI naturopath, Challen Waychoff, told me this is normal whenever your body chemistry is shifting.
In the past taking magnesium would cause my neck muscles to spasm. I'd realize that and go off it, and it would take several days to go away. (the usual, if you are used to back or neck spasms)
I didn't answer you right away, because guess what? I came down with a back spasm. This time, lol, I hadn't been taking magnesium, it happened in the usual way (overdoing exercize). However, magnesium is often on the list of things to try when you are going through back/neck spasm episodes. So I took little bit, LOL. I know, sounds nutz, and probably was. I went straight to bowel intolerance after two days of tiny mag citrate doses.
I have extremely hard water, so perhaps I really DON'T need any additional minerals. As Beefy pointed out in another thread, it is natural to get minerals from water. I have never had much luck with supplementing minerals at all, I seem to just get wicked out of balance right away. I've been drinking hard water for decades, I'm probably mostly made of granite by now.
Anyways, I'm back off the couch and doing a few chores (sigh).