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DiscussionLet's talk about it: Progress ReportsElizabethW's log

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ElizabethW's log

#1 · August 25, 2019, 6:02 am

Quote from Elizabeth Wells on August 25, 2019, 6:02 am
Hi all

I've been in the alt health world for a couple of decades now and am still chasing the same issues and symptoms.

My health improved in leaps and bounds using the Andreas Moritz liver flush- this has been the only thing to have worked permanently, otherwise I have been a non-responder to almost all interventions I have tried, and I have tried the lot!

I don't have auto-immunity so much as super low immunity. Currently I am on hydrocortisone/steroid treatment for cortisol replacement, as my adrenals pretty much stopped making cortisol after a deeply traumatic birth and multiple surgeries and infections that followed. Prior to that I had chronic fatigue and candida infection going back to childhood.

Unfortunately I can't flush anymore- I have done 55- but I have severe impaction in my liver ducts of candida fungus, and the flush is not strong enough to push the fungus out with the stones. The only thing that helps that progress is doing hot yoga which I am currently too fatigued to do. It's a vicious circle 😉 (BTW I know that this is what is stopping the stones from coming out because in the past I have seen large chunks of dense white biofilm amongst the liver stones in the toilet bowl). I know without doubt that the liver flush is very powerful and effective, and if I didn't have this candida blockage I would still be doing them every 3 weeks like clockwork!

Things that I no longer have in a serious way as a result of doing liver flushes: Multiple Chemical Sensitivity, Electrical hypersensitivity, BV (gynae infection), constant candida flares upon eating fruit. Also at one stage my cortisol went up, which was amazing and I was able to cut my medication back by 2/3rds. However over time the bile ducts get clogged up again as old bile/cholesterol deposits from higher up in the liver move down towards the main bile/cystic ducts, so for progress to continue you have to see the process through.

Symptoms I am currently dealing with:

Physical fatigue and low cortisol; at times, intense muscle weakness and lethargy (difficulty walking uphill etc)

Candida symptoms and digestive insufficiency- stomach and gut aches, bloating, gas.

Anxiety, at times this is crippling. It is largely focused on health (my son is also adrenally fatigued, as is my partner, and we all struggle daily. My son is 6 and also has ADHD and ODD and his behaviour is a nightmare).

Mood swings, anger and other signs of hormonal imbalance. Pregnenolone has helped me massively with this, and I feel more able to deal with life's challenges. I am in the early stages of menopause/pre-menopause and I am only 44.

Frequent cyclical stabbing pains in left breast (I think this is hormonal)- like a hot needle.

I would like to give the low-vit A diet a good run to see if it can help my chronic fatigue. So far I am having a bumpy ride, transitioning back into eating grains and potatoes after months on a diet mainly consisting of meat, eggs, fruit and nuts, avocados and mushrooms. In the past I have eaten WAPF style for many years and low-carb with loads of liver, eggs, fish and fish oil etc.

I have been doing low vit A for just over a week and currently some things have flared up-

joint and back ache

red and hot inflamed eyes

increased need for hydrocortisone meds at night, waking up with restless legs etc

Feelings of tension in legs

Headaches

Increased fatigue and lethargy in muscles

I suspect this is less 'detox' than introducing starches and grains again after many months off them.

Thanks for reading- I am enjoying reading everything in the discussion threads.

Hi all

I've been in the alt health world for a couple of decades now and am still chasing the same issues and symptoms.

My health improved in leaps and bounds using the Andreas Moritz liver flush- this has been the only thing to have worked permanently, otherwise I have been a non-responder to almost all interventions I have tried, and I have tried the lot!

I don't have auto-immunity so much as super low immunity. Currently I am on hydrocortisone/steroid treatment for cortisol replacement, as my adrenals pretty much stopped making cortisol after a deeply traumatic birth and multiple surgeries and infections that followed. Prior to that I had chronic fatigue and candida infection going back to childhood.

Unfortunately I can't flush anymore- I have done 55- but I have severe impaction in my liver ducts of candida fungus, and the flush is not strong enough to push the fungus out with the stones. The only thing that helps that progress is doing hot yoga which I am currently too fatigued to do. It's a vicious circle 😉 (BTW I know that this is what is stopping the stones from coming out because in the past I have seen large chunks of dense white biofilm amongst the liver stones in the toilet bowl). I know without doubt that the liver flush is very powerful and effective, and if I didn't have this candida blockage I would still be doing them every 3 weeks like clockwork!

Things that I no longer have in a serious way as a result of doing liver flushes: Multiple Chemical Sensitivity, Electrical hypersensitivity, BV (gynae infection), constant candida flares upon eating fruit. Also at one stage my cortisol went up, which was amazing and I was able to cut my medication back by 2/3rds. However over time the bile ducts get clogged up again as old bile/cholesterol deposits from higher up in the liver move down towards the main bile/cystic ducts, so for progress to continue you have to see the process through.

Symptoms I am currently dealing with:

Physical fatigue and low cortisol; at times, intense muscle weakness and lethargy (difficulty walking uphill etc)

Candida symptoms and digestive insufficiency- stomach and gut aches, bloating, gas.

Anxiety, at times this is crippling. It is largely focused on health (my son is also adrenally fatigued, as is my partner, and we all struggle daily. My son is 6 and also has ADHD and ODD and his behaviour is a nightmare).

Mood swings, anger and other signs of hormonal imbalance. Pregnenolone has helped me massively with this, and I feel more able to deal with life's challenges. I am in the early stages of menopause/pre-menopause and I am only 44.

Frequent cyclical stabbing pains in left breast (I think this is hormonal)- like a hot needle.

I would like to give the low-vit A diet a good run to see if it can help my chronic fatigue. So far I am having a bumpy ride, transitioning back into eating grains and potatoes after months on a diet mainly consisting of meat, eggs, fruit and nuts, avocados and mushrooms. In the past I have eaten WAPF style for many years and low-carb with loads of liver, eggs, fish and fish oil etc.

I have been doing low vit A for just over a week and currently some things have flared up-

joint and back ache

red and hot inflamed eyes

increased need for hydrocortisone meds at night, waking up with restless legs etc

Feelings of tension in legs

Headaches

Increased fatigue and lethargy in muscles

I suspect this is less 'detox' than introducing starches and grains again after many months off them.

Thanks for reading- I am enjoying reading everything in the discussion threads.

#2 · August 25, 2019, 7:11 am

I wrote this list of pros and cons of WAPF advice: https://ggenereux.blog/discussion/topic/wapf-pros-and-cons/

The only therapies that I have come across that could plausibly help with "autoimmune" conditions are following a low Vitamin A diet and hookworm therapy.

When dealing with autoimmune conditions we must be aware that the medical system is often to blame for causing disease. In addition to getting sick from criminal treatments like Accutane we can also suffer due to allergies and toxicity from orthopaedic implants, root canals, crowns, cavitations, mercury fillings etc.

Elizabeth Wells has reacted to this post.

#3 · August 25, 2019, 7:25 am

I have suffered with chronic fatigue in the past. When I began the low VA diet in Feb I was completely wiped out for months, I found it very difficult to work. I experienced headache, fatigue and lethargy also. While detoxing VA I even got an eyelid spasm for 2 weeks straight! Excess Vitamin A is bad when it's going in but it's even worse when it's coming out. You will likely see many symptoms improve over a period of many months Elizabeth, learning about Hypervitaminosis A and reading Grants material saved my life basically, if you've been following a WAPF style diet and have eaten a lot of VA then it will likely help you a lot too.

Elizabeth Wells has reacted to this post.

#4 · September 3, 2019, 1:48 am

Thanks for the encouragement Tim!

So one big symptom I completely forgot to list- horrible hormonal cystic acne. never had this in my life before- Had it for about a year after a series of failed liver flushes that pushed congestion further into bile ducts (which are blocked by candidiasis, as described in previous post)- at times it flares up very badly when I eat starchy foods and is red and inflamed.

Anyway 2 weeks into this way of eating and it has completely cleared up! I didn't expect such a rapid improvement and I am gobsmacked! My skin is now clear and I don't have to cake foundation on my face every day 😉

Physical fatigue is still terrible, as evidenced by increased need for hydrocortisone.

Mood is still mostly happy- even sometimes silly! This is great as most of the time I am an irritable grump, lol. On Sunday I played with my son and partner in a local park while a big band was playing and cracked them up doing a series of silly walks, a la Monty Python (not sure the other observers were impressed though).

I am mainly subsisting on potatoes, rice cakes, beef sausages, some lamb (how bad is lamb for vit A?), some turkey, courgettes, onions, black and refried beans, some dark chocolate, coconut yoghurt, bananas, dates, raisins, nuts, cricket flour, non-fatty fish, pears, tea and kombucha, coconut milk, ginger beer.

I have cut out all eggs, butter, fatty fish, avocados, coloured fruits and veg.

#5 · September 3, 2019, 1:49 am

Also I would love to either start or join a low Vit A Facebook group- anyone else up for this? I know Dr Smith has a secret group- I may still ask for his help depending how I get on.

Curious Observer has reacted to this post.

#6 · September 3, 2019, 11:25 am

I'd be up for a low VA FB group. I actually thought about doing this in the past. Please let us know if the group gets created!

#7 · September 3, 2019, 1:27 pm

Yes I will @empirebuilder31

Also how 'bad' is marmalade? It is of course made from oranges!

#8 · September 4, 2019, 12:49 pm

I think anything with oranges should likely be avoided.

Elizabeth Wells has reacted to this post.

#9 · September 5, 2019, 6:44 am

Quote from tim on September 5, 2019, 6:44 am
Hi Elizabeth,

Back in my 20s (I'm 37 now) when I was consuming cod liver oil and following WAPF style eating the best way to describe how my liver felt is "stagnated". This is a word used in TCM i.e. liver stagnation. I could feel the energetic blockage/stagnation.

The liver flush is something that can be helpful I believe as it will help remove bile that contains waste products and toxins. However, Andreas Mortitz is not correct, not many people actually have gallstones. The stones you see from the liver flush are formed in the intestine during the flush.

Candida is another alternative health meme. Yes, candida fungus overgrowth can affect people, especially immune compromised people however the incidence and nature of it are often completely overblown in alternative health circles.

Vitamin A depletion is a long term process so while I'm careful to eat low VA I'm certainly not going to be really extreme about it. I can understand people's desire to heal as quickly as possible but there is a lot of orthorexia among health seekers generally, many of us lost our health due to it. Concerns about many certain foods being too high A, in my opinion are unfounded. For example, the amount of VA in most herbs and spices is insignificant, most fruits and meats are also not high enough in VA to warrant concern in my opinion.

I personally consume an orange per day. One orange contains about 14 mcg RAE VA. In comparison, one medium carrot contains 509 mcg RAE VA. I also eat chicken. One drumstick with skin on contains about 13 mcg RAE VA (it can be higher). The RDA for an adult male is 900 mcg RAE. I also happily eat animal fat like lard and tallow which contains minimal VA. Once a week I consume a large seafood meal of squid, scallops, prawns and snapper.

Marmalade, despite containing citrus skins, contains negligible amounts of VA.

Because I avoid dairy, liver, cod liver oil, multi-vitamins and high carotene veges my diet is still very low in Vitamin A and I have had a lot of detox symptoms because of that.

Hi Elizabeth,

Back in my 20s (I'm 37 now) when I was consuming cod liver oil and following WAPF style eating the best way to describe how my liver felt is "stagnated". This is a word used in TCM i.e. liver stagnation. I could feel the energetic blockage/stagnation.

The liver flush is something that can be helpful I believe as it will help remove bile that contains waste products and toxins. However, Andreas Mortitz is not correct, not many people actually have gallstones. The stones you see from the liver flush are formed in the intestine during the flush.

Candida is another alternative health meme. Yes, candida fungus overgrowth can affect people, especially immune compromised people however the incidence and nature of it are often completely overblown in alternative health circles.

Vitamin A depletion is a long term process so while I'm careful to eat low VA I'm certainly not going to be really extreme about it. I can understand people's desire to heal as quickly as possible but there is a lot of orthorexia among health seekers generally, many of us lost our health due to it. Concerns about many certain foods being too high A, in my opinion are unfounded. For example, the amount of VA in most herbs and spices is insignificant, most fruits and meats are also not high enough in VA to warrant concern in my opinion.

I personally consume an orange per day. One orange contains about 14 mcg RAE VA. In comparison, one medium carrot contains 509 mcg RAE VA. I also eat chicken. One drumstick with skin on contains about 13 mcg RAE VA (it can be higher). The RDA for an adult male is 900 mcg RAE. I also happily eat animal fat like lard and tallow which contains minimal VA. Once a week I consume a large seafood meal of squid, scallops, prawns and snapper.

Marmalade, despite containing citrus skins, contains negligible amounts of VA.

Because I avoid dairy, liver, cod liver oil, multi-vitamins and high carotene veges my diet is still very low in Vitamin A and I have had a lot of detox symptoms because of that.

Rachel has reacted to this post.

#10 · September 9, 2019, 3:52 am

Quote from Elizabeth Wells on September 9, 2019, 3:52 am
Thanks for your response Tim. I hear what you say about the liver flush, but this is a common misconception and unfortunately has put a lot of people off doing a liver flush who would otherwise have benefited from it. I personally have overcome quite a few of my long term ailments from doing it, and this is certainly not because of any 'placebo'- I have done 55 of them, and really I wouldn't have continued if the results had been all in my mind. And I hate to contradict you but everyone has stones- they start in the liver and only when they become hard and calcified do they tend to end up in the gallbladder. Most stones cannot be detected in scans, because they are not yet calcified.

When he was 4 years' old, my son passed half a pint of stagnant green bile on his first liver flush and all his ADHD/ODD symptoms completely vanished overnight for 6 weeks (unfortunately we can't persuade him to do another one).

Because of my lifelong Candida overgrowth I have it in my liver ducts and it blocks the stones' exit- thus 80% of all my flushes have been unproductive and have resulted in not a single stone emerging. Since I take the same ingredients each time, you would imagine- if the flush was a result of some miraculous emulsification happening in the intestines- that I would still see stones in the loo bowl, however most flushes have resulted in absolutely nothing- no stones.

I have passed the same stones, albeit a bit smaller, using stone-softening agents such as vinegar and malic acid- no oil was taken at these times yet still I produced small bile and cholesterol stones, so this is another bit of evidence that they are not 'soap stones' or whatever.

The times I had a successful flush my energy went up, chronic symptoms such as my chemical and electrical sensitivity resolved even further, and I was able to take less medication. I run a group on Facebook in which others have also tried the liver flush and are making progress in their chemical and electrical sensitivities.

The times the flush has failed my symptoms unfortunately start to come back, as my liver struggles with blocked and congested ducts again.

Candida overgrowth is also very real- but yes, it is a by-product of compromised immunity/weak adrenals, but predominantly, surprise surprise, a congested liver. Once I got my bile flowing after a series of liver flushes, my issues with candida just melted away overnight. Bile is what keeps our microbiome clean and establishes the right pH to cultivate healthy bacteria. However I am now stuck again as I am encountering dense and very old biofilm from decades back, as the flush has dug further back into past deposits. Until I can eliminate this stuff (and I have seen it - dense, rubbery deposits) I am not currently putting myself through any more flushes.

Thanks for your response Tim. I hear what you say about the liver flush, but this is a common misconception and unfortunately has put a lot of people off doing a liver flush who would otherwise have benefited from it. I personally have overcome quite a few of my long term ailments from doing it, and this is certainly not because of any 'placebo'- I have done 55 of them, and really I wouldn't have continued if the results had been all in my mind. And I hate to contradict you but everyone has stones- they start in the liver and only when they become hard and calcified do they tend to end up in the gallbladder. Most stones cannot be detected in scans, because they are not yet calcified.

When he was 4 years' old, my son passed half a pint of stagnant green bile on his first liver flush and all his ADHD/ODD symptoms completely vanished overnight for 6 weeks (unfortunately we can't persuade him to do another one).
Because of my lifelong Candida overgrowth I have it in my liver ducts and it blocks the stones' exit- thus 80% of all my flushes have been unproductive and have resulted in not a single stone emerging. Since I take the same ingredients each time, you would imagine- if the flush was a result of some miraculous emulsification happening in the intestines- that I would still see stones in the loo bowl, however most flushes have resulted in absolutely nothing- no stones.
I have passed the same stones, albeit a bit smaller, using stone-softening agents such as vinegar and malic acid- no oil was taken at these times yet still I produced small bile and cholesterol stones, so this is another bit of evidence that they are not 'soap stones' or whatever.
The times I had a successful flush my energy went up, chronic symptoms such as my chemical and electrical sensitivity resolved even further, and I was able to take less medication. I run a group on Facebook in which others have also tried the liver flush and are making progress in their chemical and electrical sensitivities.
The times the flush has failed my symptoms unfortunately start to come back, as my liver struggles with blocked and congested ducts again.

Candida overgrowth is also very real- but yes, it is a by-product of compromised immunity/weak adrenals, but predominantly, surprise surprise, a congested liver. Once I got my bile flowing after a series of liver flushes, my issues with candida just melted away overnight. Bile is what keeps our microbiome clean and establishes the right pH to cultivate healthy bacteria. However I am now stuck again as I am encountering dense and very old biofilm from decades back, as the flush has dug further back into past deposits. Until I can eliminate this stuff (and I have seen it - dense, rubbery deposits) I am not currently putting myself through any more flushes.

ElizabethW's log

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