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Carnivore and Bile Acid Malabsorption
Could you explain how copper can cause problems? How do I know I have too much of it? As I said I ate a ton of beef heart too. Could this be a problem? How does it manifest?
I also got some weird skin symptoms in the past few days when going into the sun. My legs get burning red instantly and the skin looks like the one of an alcoholic face (very smal red veins) Why is that?
Thanks for your answer.
Re: the reddit censorship: OMG that is terrible! I believe in karma... Lots of bad karma coming for people who censor...
After saying I don't personally eat beef heart on a vitamin A detox a week or two ago on this thread, I ate some beef heart today and will likely incorporate it for a while. I looked back at some fancy test results from January on the Genova Ions Organic Acids Test. They are consistent with B vitamins deficiency, so I will eat some heart to see if I get any subjective improvements.
In terms of data on the vitamin A content of heart, that Finnish grad student's study from the 1980s says that pork heart has a similar vitamin A content to pork muscle meat. Why I don't buy the actual numbers from that study, maybe the intuition that heart tissue is similar to muscle meat tissue is relevant, so if you would eat muscle meat than heart wouldn't be bad.
I'm not super clear on copper metabolism. I just know that it is often found in high quantities in liver and kidney alongside Vitamin A, that it seems to be reliant on Vitamin A for functionality (this is the reason Morley Robbins promotes liver and cod liver oil consumption), and that excessive amounts can inhibit zinc absorption and possibly functionality. It also seems like Vitamin A toxicity might lead to copper "pooling" in the liver and becoming immobilized, but I have not read any primary literature myself that says that, so it is just a general impression I've gotten from reading things about Vitamin A toxicity...I can't point at anything in particular at the moment to back that up. So, if you're getting plenty of zinc from muscle meat, it's quite likely you don't need to worry about excessive copper intake from food.
When I've watched Saladino's videos in the past several months, I can't help but think the guy talks a million miles an hour because he's wired on copper from eating liver lol. @jiri has said that copper is a stimulant that can lead to that kind of behavior.
The skin sensitivity could very well be due to Vitamin A toxicity, which is well known to increase the chance of burning. I've gotten a bunch of little tiny, almost imperceptible red lines pop up around my skin since going on a low Vitamin A diet, that look similar to spider veins (which I've also gotten in small numbers here and there) except they're red instead of purplish-blue. I believe those are also linked with Vitamin A toxicity.
It seems like pretty much any skin, nail, or mucous membrane symptom could be due to Vitamin A toxicity...my list of those symptoms is quite long, as you saw earlier, and they pretty much all happened after I removed Vitamin A from my diet. At this point, it seems very clear to me that getting Vitamin A out of storage in the peripheral tissues is way more damaging than putting it into the tissues in the first place, and I suspect that is because it gets converted to retinoic acid in the tissues when they eject it. Retinoic acid can be highly caustic and does not appear to get bound up by Retinol Binding Protein, which is what safely transports retinol for delivery to the tissues in the first place.
Interesting. So it shouldn't be a problem when combined with a lot of muscle meat? I certainly don't feel wired. I sleep very well since eliminating coffee actually and thus feel calm.
The skin thing is weird. I've never been sensitive to the sun but it makes sense.
How could VA toxicity lead to weight gain though? I feel like my body holds on to body fat (or maybe water but I doubt it is water) for deer life, even though I eat hardly any fat?! Before stopping the organ meats I could basically eat as much protein as I wanted while staying very lean. How is it even possible to gain body fat on protein? This should be impossible given the thermic affect and the livers limit in converting aminos to carbs/fats??! Any experience or explanation?
With the copper, again, I am not confident enough about it to tell you either way...sorry. Most of the side effects of copper overload seem to be related to mental/mood disturbance, so if you're feeling pretty good on that front then my best guess is you are probably fine with the intake you have. On the flipside, copper deficiency seems strongly associated with low energy levels, which might be one of the best signs that you need more of it.
Your weight gain does seem a little odd. How much are we talking? It sounds like you're pretty sure it's additional weight that you shouldn't have?
Seems like there is a higher likelihood of losing weight from Vitamin A toxicity than gaining it, whereas other forms of toxicity could lead to weight gain. (I lost about 5 pounds when I first went on a low Vitamin A diet and have not regained it yet, even when I've tried reintroducing white rice.) My best guess is that your gain is either from inflammation (how does your body feel these days?), thyroid/slow metabolism, or you are actually returning to a healthier weight (you'll have to tell us what you think your ideal weight is and how far you are from that right now).
So, your skin has just very recently become sensitive to the sun, but it wasn't before you cut out organ meats?
Meat is also full of unhealthy antinutrient substances that make you sick and age faster, it's not just plants. Things such as excessive amounts of tryptophan, cysteine, methinonine, heme iron, phosphorus, polyunsaturated fat (in non-ruminant animals). Not to mention all the carcinogens that form when you cook it, if you cook it. There is no such thing as a perfect food.
Of course there is no "perfect food" that gives us only what we need at the moment and nothing more. The best you can do is feed your body what it was best designed to handle - fatty meat. These points have been discussed at length by all the big names in the carnivore community, no need for me to waste my time repeating them. Our bodies are normally robust to the intake of some plant foods, but there's no doubt we have better mechanisms for handling the nutritional excesses in meat than we do the straight-up toxins and indigestible parts of plants.
I'm not aware of any mood changes. I've had minor anxiety and depression and OCD tendencies since forever. Maybe I'll experiment with not eating beef heart. Can I test for copper toxicity? Is an elevated blood copper level indicative?
With the weight: I'm not overweight by any means and I probably needed a little more weight. But it is strange that I all of a sudden gain weight (and fat) with the same foods I stayed very lean before. In the past I could eat all the protein in the world and nothing happened. I wonder if maybe inflammation plays a role here? It could increase cortisol which leads to more insulin resistance and thus causes weight gain. Is that possible?
Skin: Yes. I never burned. Now everything is so dried up that I get red immediately. When exposed to the sun my skin also becomes like sandpaper. Extremely dry and sensitive...
