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Detox setback and adaptable body type
Quote from Andrew B on March 18, 2023, 9:22 am@jiri I could never drink more than 4 beers. Wish I'd taken the signs earlier. I also discovered I had an intolerance to beer when I tested foods 10-20 years later.
@armin After my choline replenishment exercise I'm finding great benefit from incorporating sulforaphane foods like broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts and white cabbage. I cottoned on to the devil's plan. It was to make us fear all foods so we'd stop eating anything
I'm considering buying a supplement and calling it a day. Looking back, I did feel the best when I ate cruciferous foods.
I was thinking about actions of foods like broccoli/etc and their effects when consumed. The central doctrine of the LYL faith is that we are to avoid all things that are not essential, i.e. stick with minerals, water, macros. Anything that does provide relief or improvement that isn't essential must have a sinister action that is to be avoided. I really don't agree with this simple minded approach.
There are plenty of modalities that we use in medicine that aren't essential but are effective for what they are trying to accomplish. Get at cut? Apply a bandage and Neosporin and it heals better, faster. Oh no, not those sinister non-essentials again. That bandage and ointment is not gonna end well. It must be suppressing some all important mechanism and shoving bile back into the liver. That is how silly is sounds when they apply that logic to everything. We use things that help. Not poo poo everything in a rigid dogmatic way.
What is interesting to note about the sulforaphane article is that the increase in ALDH activity due to the presence of sulforaphane carried over to other substrates, in this case, being acetaldehyde, essentially putting to rest the idea that these compounds just increase detox pathways for themselves.
Black tea and oolong tea has shown to increase ADH and ALDH while coffee shuts down the latter.
Jenny, 30 years ago after months of cachexia while trying to formulate supplements and plentiful high quality food my doc of 2 years compared my perspective to an inexperienced pilot trying to fly a 747 mid flight by reading the aircraft's manual as I went. She convinced me since she had survived a similar immune allergy massive weight loss after taking antibiotics to kill off the heliobacter blamed for causing her ulcers.
She gave me the needed pause. Coincidentally (and there are none) I ran across a holocaust book (Corey Tenboom I think) and sympathised alot. That put prisoners of war on my librarian's horizon and she got me articles on those who survived death camps and how. The first survivors died shortly after being freed and fed. They were fed too much too fast. Wiser souls figured out to trickle in foods slowly. This allowed those suffering depleted pancreases and digestive tracts time and materials to build enzymes from the renewed protein and fat intakes to digest the new and slowly increasing food intakes.
I read a few more books along that line and slowly gained back the 33% of weight I lost and then a bit more. She is still my doc in her 70's and not the ideal athletic build but impressive on what she still does and learns. She is still recognizing that we are most certainly wrong about what we currently believe. We still need to work with what we believe where we are. Now she is working on whether or not my ideas on VA toxicity are worth a look at her age.
Hope you feel better soon.
@ronn Just a short note about the anti-inflammatory effect of omega 3. It's important to note how it does this. It does it by turning off the immune-system. It doesn't fix the CAUSES for innflamation it only shuts down the body's reaction too it. That's why there is a warnng (also in Norway on the seal-oil) to not take to much omega 3 as it will lead you to prone to infections and the like. I'd like to add that this is a well-known mechanism and not dependent on any discussion about wether EFA are essential. According to mainstream science it is "double-edged sword" - Last year also the oncological institute in Norway issued another warning about another "double-edged" problem of increased fish eating and omega-3 supplementation. While the institute belives it to be a necessary part of the diet, they are issuing warnings because they see a proportional increase in stomach and intestinal cancer to the increase in omega-3 intake in the population in Norway.
Quote from Henrik on May 7, 2023, 6:03 am@ronn Just a short note about the anti-inflammatory effect of omega 3. It's important to note how it does this. It does it by turning off the immune-system. It doesn't fix the CAUSES for innflamation it only shuts down the body's reaction too it. That's why there is a warnng (also in Norway on the seal-oil) to not take to much omega 3 as it will lead you to prone to infections and the like. I'd like to add that this is a well-known mechanism and not dependent on any discussion about wether EFA are essential. According to mainstream science it is "double-edged sword" - Last year also the oncological institute in Norway issued another warning about another "double-edged" problem of increased fish eating and omega-3 supplementation. While the institute belives it to be a necessary part of the diet, they are issuing warnings because they see a proportional increase in stomach and intestinal cancer to the increase in omega-3 intake in the population in Norway.
interesting. Maybe traditionally a high omega 3 diet did not cause an problems in Norway, but after technology increased so dramatically and Norway is one of the most tech evolved countries too, the omega 3 turned into kind of a poison instead? I wonder about this. What a sad thing if the omega 3 fats used to be healthy and now they are not much healthy anymore because of our changed environment. Who knows if the same could be said about vitamin A. Could at least be a partial cause of the issue. I do know for sure that vitamin A is seasonal in the body and works together with the natural light signalling, which is now less and less because of peoples fear of the sun and skin cancer...people dont go in the sun without UV protection, glasses and creams.
@inger Hi. thanks for the feedback. Well, I will try to be as transparent as possible. I myself have the impression that pufa's from external sources are not truly a benefit in itself, but I find it to be a separate question to what I addressed in my previous post. I can argue for that but I find it to be a lot of discussion and usally not much benefit from it so I try to see if there are points that can be discussed without having to tackle that question. The points I listed are part of what I find to be discussable even if one has a different idea then my own on omega 3's. So even if I have that point of view, now that I stated where I come from, I still think there is room for a lot of nuances and obviously people have been living long healthy lifes while still ingesting both pufa's and omega3 s. So I think you are on to something regardless. If we take a broader perspective I think all these stressors on the body is accumulative. If you have a lot of radiation, microplastics, poor air-quality, psychological stress and not to mention the general bombardment of light and chemicals your body definately will handle substances differently and generally more poorly. I think that goes for both pufa's and vitamin A. I also think the seasonal aspect is very interesting though unfortunatly I dont know much reliable info on just that but it makes sense. Both eating habits, light-exposure, and routines would traditionally change during the year. Cod-liver oil was only taken in winter (by the coastal population who actually consumed it- most didnt), and not for the oil but for the vitamin D most likely. I am though very sceptical of the idea that people ate a lot of pufas at least in the scandinavian countries in sub-arctic areas. If we take the menus and eating habits know to us historically and add to that archeology there wasnt a lot of pufa or omega 3 consumption after the end of the last ice-age when seal hunting and walrusses vaned. (simplified version). Of course this varied from place to place but very crudely people would eat barley, some oats, potatoes from the 16/17 hundres onwards, cabbage, some milk, a bit of pig around christmas time, and sheeps meat. It was then supplemented with fish. In the coastal areas which are substantiall in length people often ate a lot of fish as it was an available sources, but its interesting to know that people avoided the fatty fish as far as possible. Red fish like salmon and trout where scorned upon and white lowfat fish was praised, especially varities of cod. This was so significant to people that there was laws against giving the poor hired workers at farms and other low society status people to much salmon as it was mostly fit for animal feed according to the general concensus. Just argued by "it makes you weak". Even my own grandparents knew about this from their youth that salmon was poormens fish. SO Im not saying that it was no consumption, the most striking difference I guess is that people didnt have vegetable oils or supplements. They did suffer from lack of vitamin c, vitamin bs and sometimes zinc deficiencies as far as I know so Im not saying everything was so great and they where supersmart but they didnt seem to consume a lot of omega 3s either. They conciously avoided it as far as they was able to. And they didnt have supplements, not for omega 3s either. I think these things are more relevant when we have these "extracts" available nowadays, then when you get it through food. Traditionally if you were not an inuitt or some special subgroups avoiding vitamin a or pufas wasnt a relevant problem. Your body probably handled it better and the exposure was minimal. You would have to eat like 50kilos of whole grains a day to get the amount of omega6 we now get from a potion of french fries. So they only tried not eating to much fatty/red fish and get some protein and that was it. Now this turned from being a short musing to somewhat lecturing maybe. I didnt intend to but I thin these factors are interesting to consider. Im not sure if I lost you during the ride but I think these points are mostly safe to state without having to agree on everything about if we need pufa's. My go to is that what can be said for sure is that lots of people didnt have access to pufas historically and did fine so at least I dont buy its harmful to avoid them
@henrik, interesting poinst you make.
I visit a 100 year old lady once a weak in a nursing home, and spend a couple hour with her and her former maid(97 yo) that lives in the same nursing home, and the older lady does not eat salmon. The younger lady(who eats everything) tells me the older lady do not like salmon, because it is too "fatty". She always was like that from what I understand. The maid is from poor family and the 100 yo is very wealthy.
Maybe it has to do with what you wrote above, how cool 🙂
The 100 yo loves dark 100% rye bread, she can eat that all day long with butter.....