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Might have found something
Quote from
tar on October 15, 2019, 7:17 am
For those having detox symptoms and having a rough go of it, I have an experiment for you.
Try a high dose niacin flush, like 1000mg to 1500mg at one go, just for one day, and see how you are after it.
I tried this yesterday and many of my breathing symptoms seem to have calmed down somewhat.
Niacin does ALOT so why this worked I am not sure yet. Could be tied to methylation, fat burning verse carb burning, digestion, or something else.
For those having detox symptoms and having a rough go of it, I have an experiment for you.
Try a high dose niacin flush, like 1000mg to 1500mg at one go, just for one day, and see how you are after it.
I tried this yesterday and many of my breathing symptoms seem to have calmed down somewhat.
Niacin does ALOT so why this worked I am not sure yet. Could be tied to methylation, fat burning verse carb burning, digestion, or something else.
romaine has reacted to this post.
Quote from
bludicka on October 15, 2019, 11:06 pm
I did in the past hot baths, infrasauna+niacin detox but the dose 1000-1500 mg is very high, can be dangerous. Start with 50-100mg, some people can get a flush with low doses, I had a flush reaction with 100-150 mg. Then I read that the high doses of niacin (mainly extended release niacin) can damage the liver. Probably ok for the occasional detox - but it must be regular form of niacin, not slow release niacin.
I will try the niacin if I will have any relief. In the past I've never had positive effects from the niacin. I had positive effects from folate, B1 and B2.
Maybe you need more niacin?
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/podcast/2019/03/01/niacin-part-1-need/
I did in the past hot baths, infrasauna+niacin detox but the dose 1000-1500 mg is very high, can be dangerous. Start with 50-100mg, some people can get a flush with low doses, I had a flush reaction with 100-150 mg. Then I read that the high doses of niacin (mainly extended release niacin) can damage the liver. Probably ok for the occasional detox - but it must be regular form of niacin, not slow release niacin.
I will try the niacin if I will have any relief. In the past I've never had positive effects from the niacin. I had positive effects from folate, B1 and B2.
Maybe you need more niacin?
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/podcast/2019/03/01/niacin-part-1-need/
Donald has reacted to this post.
Quote from
Rachel on October 16, 2019, 1:30 am
That's interesting @tar I take high dose niacin daily and find it a real help. It is one of the few supplements I take and without it I really struggle emotionally. Have you read "Niacin the real story" by Abram Hoffer? There is a mention in there, almost an aside, saying that niacin is important to detoxification in the liver. Certain p450 enzymes have a niacin dependant cofactor (NADPH). These enzymes are involved in the metabolism of vit A.
If you don't have enough niacin then that becomes a limiting factor in your ability to detox. It's possible that you gave your detox capacity a boost when you took the niacin.
That's interesting @tar I take high dose niacin daily and find it a real help. It is one of the few supplements I take and without it I really struggle emotionally. Have you read "Niacin the real story" by Abram Hoffer? There is a mention in there, almost an aside, saying that niacin is important to detoxification in the liver. Certain p450 enzymes have a niacin dependant cofactor (NADPH). These enzymes are involved in the metabolism of vit A.
If you don't have enough niacin then that becomes a limiting factor in your ability to detox. It's possible that you gave your detox capacity a boost when you took the niacin.
Quote from
tar on October 16, 2019, 7:27 am
Quote from
bludicka on October 15, 2019, 11:06 pm
I did in the past hot baths, infrasauna+niacin detox but the dose 1000-1500 mg is very high, can be dangerous. Start with 50-100mg, some people can get a flush with low doses, I had a flush reaction with 100-150 mg. Then I read that the high doses of niacin (mainly extended release niacin) can damage the liver. Probably ok for the occasional detox - but it must be regular form of niacin, not slow release niacin.
I will try the niacin if I will have any relief. In the past I've never had positive effects from the niacin. I had positive effects from folate, B1 and B2.
Maybe you need more niacin?
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/podcast/2019/03/01/niacin-part-1-need/
It is weird, you are the third one to say niacin is risky. Am I totally blind to some study because all I can find is that niacin can be risky over 7-9g? (excluding the slow release which I didn't mention) If you could point me to the risky part I would appreciate it.
Quote from
Rachel on October 16, 2019, 1:30 am
That's interesting @tar I take high dose niacin daily and find it a real help. It is one of the few supplements I take and without it I really struggle emotionally. Have you read "Niacin the real story" by Abram Hoffer? There is a mention in there, almost an aside, saying that niacin is important to detoxification in the liver. Certain p450 enzymes have a niacin dependant cofactor (NADPH). These enzymes are involved in the metabolism of vit A.
If you don't have enough niacin then that becomes a limiting factor in your ability to detox. It's possible that you gave your detox capacity a boost when you took the niacin.
Yeah that is possible. Do you deal with bad detox symptoms?
Quote from
bludicka on October 15, 2019, 11:06 pm
I did in the past hot baths, infrasauna+niacin detox but the dose 1000-1500 mg is very high, can be dangerous. Start with 50-100mg, some people can get a flush with low doses, I had a flush reaction with 100-150 mg. Then I read that the high doses of niacin (mainly extended release niacin) can damage the liver. Probably ok for the occasional detox - but it must be regular form of niacin, not slow release niacin.
I will try the niacin if I will have any relief. In the past I've never had positive effects from the niacin. I had positive effects from folate, B1 and B2.
Maybe you need more niacin?
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/podcast/2019/03/01/niacin-part-1-need/
It is weird, you are the third one to say niacin is risky. Am I totally blind to some study because all I can find is that niacin can be risky over 7-9g? (excluding the slow release which I didn't mention) If you could point me to the risky part I would appreciate it.
Quote from
Rachel on October 16, 2019, 1:30 am
That's interesting @tar I take high dose niacin daily and find it a real help. It is one of the few supplements I take and without it I really struggle emotionally. Have you read "Niacin the real story" by Abram Hoffer? There is a mention in there, almost an aside, saying that niacin is important to detoxification in the liver. Certain p450 enzymes have a niacin dependant cofactor (NADPH). These enzymes are involved in the metabolism of vit A.
If you don't have enough niacin then that becomes a limiting factor in your ability to detox. It's possible that you gave your detox capacity a boost when you took the niacin.
Yeah that is possible. Do you deal with bad detox symptoms?
Quote from
bludicka on October 16, 2019, 10:16 pm
Interestingly, you need such a high dose 1000-1500 mg to have a flush effect. If such a high dose is taken regularly, I would be concerned about the imbalance of other B vitamins.
https://livertox.nih.gov/Niacin.htm
https://www.ashp.org/news/2007/04/19/colorado_poison_center_reports_on_niacin_toxicity
Interestingly, you need such a high dose 1000-1500 mg to have a flush effect. If such a high dose is taken regularly, I would be concerned about the imbalance of other B vitamins.
https://livertox.nih.gov/Niacin.htm
https://www.ashp.org/news/2007/04/19/colorado_poison_center_reports_on_niacin_toxicity
Quote from
Rachel on October 17, 2019, 12:59 am
"do you deal with bad detox symptoms" @tar
I have had bad detox symptoms in the past pre low VA. I basically couldn't do or eat anything that is generally considered to promote detoxifying. I have learned through experience to do things very gradually and carefully. Now I'm low VA I tend to have low level detox symptoms. They seem to cycle but I don't get much of a break. It is at a level I can manage though. Mostly its even lower energy, jaw pain, headache and mood and emotional problems, anxiety, gut pain. I don't get severe flares, something I'm grateful for. It's possible that my intake of niacin is helping me here but I'm not willing to experiment just yet.
I do very little that would aggravate the VA detox though. I am pretty debilitated so exercise, sweating etc is just not something that I am able to do. I have avoided the sun as much as possible as this is a certain trigger for me. I am not able to eat foods that mobilise VA or alcohol. I think many people just in the normal course of life do things that may stimulate the VA detox and I am not able to do those things. It is going v slowly for me but I don't think my body would withstand anything faster.
"do you deal with bad detox symptoms" @tar
I have had bad detox symptoms in the past pre low VA. I basically couldn't do or eat anything that is generally considered to promote detoxifying. I have learned through experience to do things very gradually and carefully. Now I'm low VA I tend to have low level detox symptoms. They seem to cycle but I don't get much of a break. It is at a level I can manage though. Mostly its even lower energy, jaw pain, headache and mood and emotional problems, anxiety, gut pain. I don't get severe flares, something I'm grateful for. It's possible that my intake of niacin is helping me here but I'm not willing to experiment just yet.
I do very little that would aggravate the VA detox though. I am pretty debilitated so exercise, sweating etc is just not something that I am able to do. I have avoided the sun as much as possible as this is a certain trigger for me. I am not able to eat foods that mobilise VA or alcohol. I think many people just in the normal course of life do things that may stimulate the VA detox and I am not able to do those things. It is going v slowly for me but I don't think my body would withstand anything faster.
Quote from
tar on October 17, 2019, 7:04 am
Quote from
Rachel on October 17, 2019, 12:59 am
"do you deal with bad detox symptoms" @tar
I have had bad detox symptoms in the past pre low VA. I basically couldn't do or eat anything that is generally considered to promote detoxifying. I have learned through experience to do things very gradually and carefully. Now I'm low VA I tend to have low level detox symptoms. They seem to cycle but I don't get much of a break. It is at a level I can manage though. Mostly its even lower energy, jaw pain, headache and mood and emotional problems, anxiety, gut pain. I don't get severe flares, something I'm grateful for. It's possible that my intake of niacin is helping me here but I'm not willing to experiment just yet.
I do very little that would aggravate the VA detox though. I am pretty debilitated so exercise, sweating etc is just not something that I am able to do. I have avoided the sun as much as possible as this is a certain trigger for me. I am not able to eat foods that mobilise VA or alcohol. I think many people just in the normal course of life do things that may stimulate the VA detox and I am not able to do those things. It is going v slowly for me but I don't think my body would withstand anything faster.
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Quote from
Rachel on October 17, 2019, 12:59 am
"do you deal with bad detox symptoms" @tar
I have had bad detox symptoms in the past pre low VA. I basically couldn't do or eat anything that is generally considered to promote detoxifying. I have learned through experience to do things very gradually and carefully. Now I'm low VA I tend to have low level detox symptoms. They seem to cycle but I don't get much of a break. It is at a level I can manage though. Mostly its even lower energy, jaw pain, headache and mood and emotional problems, anxiety, gut pain. I don't get severe flares, something I'm grateful for. It's possible that my intake of niacin is helping me here but I'm not willing to experiment just yet.
I do very little that would aggravate the VA detox though. I am pretty debilitated so exercise, sweating etc is just not something that I am able to do. I have avoided the sun as much as possible as this is a certain trigger for me. I am not able to eat foods that mobilise VA or alcohol. I think many people just in the normal course of life do things that may stimulate the VA detox and I am not able to do those things. It is going v slowly for me but I don't think my body would withstand anything faster.
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Quote from
romaine on November 12, 2019, 8:55 pm
Quote from
tar on October 17, 2019, 7:04 am
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Tar, I tried less than 100 mgs of niacin powder (opened capsule) a couple of hours ago and flushed for about 40 minutes - felt it on my face, arms, hands, legs. Itched a bit but not too bad. I am concerned if I do the 1,000 I might really suffer. My stomach felt weird/nauseated at first but didn't last long but worry that at a much higher dose I might feel super sick and vomit or just be in pain. Any thoughts on dosing for someone who flushes at less than 100mgs? Are you still taking it? Any updates?
I'll post any changes or not that I experience.
Quote from
tar on October 17, 2019, 7:04 am
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Tar, I tried less than 100 mgs of niacin powder (opened capsule) a couple of hours ago and flushed for about 40 minutes - felt it on my face, arms, hands, legs. Itched a bit but not too bad. I am concerned if I do the 1,000 I might really suffer. My stomach felt weird/nauseated at first but didn't last long but worry that at a much higher dose I might feel super sick and vomit or just be in pain. Any thoughts on dosing for someone who flushes at less than 100mgs? Are you still taking it? Any updates?
I'll post any changes or not that I experience.
Quote from
Rachel on November 13, 2019, 9:51 am
@romaine
I take a different form so I can't give my personal experience (due to gut sensitivity, otherwise I would take the basic flushing form), but the advice I came across suggested increasing by 25mg increments.
@romaine
I take a different form so I can't give my personal experience (due to gut sensitivity, otherwise I would take the basic flushing form), but the advice I came across suggested increasing by 25mg increments.
romaine has reacted to this post.
Quote from
tar on November 16, 2019, 12:53 pm
Quote from
romaine on November 12, 2019, 8:55 pm
Quote from
tar on October 17, 2019, 7:04 am
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Tar, I tried less than 100 mgs of niacin powder (opened capsule) a couple of hours ago and flushed for about 40 minutes - felt it on my face, arms, hands, legs. Itched a bit but not too bad. I am concerned if I do the 1,000 I might really suffer. My stomach felt weird/nauseated at first but didn't last long but worry that at a much higher dose I might feel super sick and vomit or just be in pain. Any thoughts on dosing for someone who flushes at less than 100mgs? Are you still taking it? Any updates?
I'll post any changes or not that I experience.
I think if you flush then you are getting the effects. Did it do anything for your detox symptoms? Niacin worked for my detox problems for about a week and then stopped working. I still take 1000mgs here or there occasionally, and it'll make my skin look nicer and I feel nice for a few hours afterwards...but as a permanent solution it did not measure up.
Quote from
romaine on November 12, 2019, 8:55 pm
Quote from
tar on October 17, 2019, 7:04 am
Ahh okay. So you already take Naicin then pretty regularly it sounds like. I was looking for people who have bad detox symptoms, don't take niacin, to try a high dose flush just once to see how they do on it and whether it helps or not. If you decide to mess around with the dose, let us know what you find.
Tar, I tried less than 100 mgs of niacin powder (opened capsule) a couple of hours ago and flushed for about 40 minutes - felt it on my face, arms, hands, legs. Itched a bit but not too bad. I am concerned if I do the 1,000 I might really suffer. My stomach felt weird/nauseated at first but didn't last long but worry that at a much higher dose I might feel super sick and vomit or just be in pain. Any thoughts on dosing for someone who flushes at less than 100mgs? Are you still taking it? Any updates?
I'll post any changes or not that I experience.
I think if you flush then you are getting the effects. Did it do anything for your detox symptoms? Niacin worked for my detox problems for about a week and then stopped working. I still take 1000mgs here or there occasionally, and it'll make my skin look nicer and I feel nice for a few hours afterwards...but as a permanent solution it did not measure up.
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