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NAD deficiency - is this a major issue for vA toxicity/detox?
I had a chat with Beth Shirley (Nitric Oxide expert) on Facebook.
‘Jenny Jones
I do have a couple practitioners using NAD along with good doses of the the Berkeley Life for long haul virus/jab patients.
The key here is optimizing the nitrate to nitrite to NO pathway along with NAD.
Giving NAD to someone with up regulated NADPH oxidase is playing with fire. You may be stimulating this enzyme even more increasing superoxide production & oxidative stress.’
‘Jenny Jones Use the test strips to make sure your levels are optimized, either with the high nitrate veggies or with Berkeley.
Oxytocin & NO are intricately intertwined.
Oxytocin raises NO. NO must be present for endogenous oxytocin to be produced.....’
I’ve ordered some test strips to assess my nitric oxide. The low vA diet can be low in high nitrate vegetables. Older people rely more on the exogenous route to produce NO, so us over 40s may have more of an issue with a lack of green leafy veg.
Fascinating stuff, Jenny! You are on fire! 🔥
Now you’ve gotten me looking up high-nitrate fruits and vegetables...beets, beat greens, red spinach, arugula, bok choy, broccoli, celery, swiss chard, green spinach, kale, mustard greens, rhubarb, radish, watercress, turnips, chinese cabbage, onion, garlic, apples, bananas, grapes, watermelon, pears, peaches, oranges, strawberries... 🍓
Some of these I do eat regularly, but not in large portions... Do you think there’s a specific amount of dietary nitrate to aim for, @jaj? Or is it more individual, I guess.
What you’ve said about dietary fats brings to mind an article on Health Rising I read earlier today, about the work of a researcher named Julian Ambrus who believes for people with mitochondrial deficiencies, a diet low in long-chain fatty acids is helpful:
It made me think an important factor in Grant’s recovery from the grave kidney disease could be his near total avoidance of seed oils (as I recall, he only ate 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil per day maximum, and did not do so every day).
I’m not sure how or if that chemically fits into your hypothesis here, Jenny, but it piqued my interest since my body seems to be strongly rejecting oils and greasy foods for the most part the past few months... And because it is so exciting to hear your POTS improved after cutting out the seed oils! 😁
I am glad if the supplements are having a positive effect, too. Just happier you’re feeling better in general! 😊☀️🌈
It’s frustrating covid has caused setbacks (it did for me, too—I had it in 2020–perhaps I should consider B12 supplementation), but I do appreciate the silver lining you mention...An opportunity to find solutions to the suffering.
Thank you for sharing what you are finding with us! I so appreciate your efforts to use your knowledge to dig deeper.
I’m curious about what the test strips will reveal when you get them. 🙂
Yes nicotinic acid by helping NAD is very harsh for me. Fire Fire Fire. It definitely clears something around the eyes and the head.
Oxytocin & NO are intricately intertwined.
Oxytocin raises NO. NO must be present for endogenous oxytocin to be produced.....’
Interesting what I wrote before about playing with dogs. https://ggenereux.blog/discussion/topic/oxytocin-playing-with-dogs/#postid-16125 And There is also the mantra chanting solution. Singing AUM raises nitric oxide as does snoring.
Another related study reported on by Court Johnson:
If GPCR autoantibodies in the ME/CFS patients’ plasma were reducing the production of nitric oxide as suspected, the NO inhibition should show up most readily when they were introduced.
The study, though, found reduced eNOS production across the board: both at baseline and when enhanced with factors like bradykinin, histamine, acetylcholine, and insulin. Whether the endothelial cells were exposed to GPCR-related factors, or insulin, or were not exposed to any factors at all, once the ME/CFS patients’ plasma hit the endothelial cells, their production of nitric oxide tanked. That didn’t mean the GPCR autoantibodies were out as a possible culprit but did suggest something more complex was going on.
Further testing revealed that the signal to produce NO; i.e. eNOS gene expression was, in fact, normal; i.e. the genes designed to produce NO did respond. The fact that eNOS protein levels were normal as well suggested that something “post-translational” found in the plasma was interfering in the step from eNOS to the actual production of NO.
Increased levels of the Thr495 eNOS protein that inactivates eNOS and makes it less likely to interact with calcium suggested that problems with calcium metabolism might be present. That finding indirectly supported Wirth and Scheibenbogen’s novel claim that problems with calcium handling could underlie all of ME/CFS. The authors also suggested that inflammation could be behind the Thr495 eNOS elevations.
https://www.healthrising.org/blog/2022/02/11/x-factor-blood-vessel-chronic-fatigue-endothelial/
^ This perhaps isn't so helpful for people with ME/CFS, but apparently short bursts of anaerobic exercise triggers the body to produce Nitric Oxide. It takes a couple of hours for it to regenerate.
This study is over my head, but it gives me the impression there are potentially several ways production of Nitric Oxide is suppressed in CFS/ME:
Altered endothelial dysfunction-related miRs in plasma from ME/CFS patients - PubMed (nih.gov)
"Our findings also support the hypothesis that endothelial homeostasis is an underestimated and partially addressed process which might play an important role in the complex pathophysiology of ME/CFS."
I’ve been quiet on this chat for a while as became focused on sorting out my red eye!
My NO test sticks showed that my NO was optimal that morning. I should probably repeat a few times to be sure. So nitric oxide may not be an issue for me. It’s quite complicated and I haven’t fully understood it all yet. I found a paper about nitric oxide, inflammation and eyes that I need to re-read. I’m moving house so research has been put aside for a while.
I stopped playing around with B vitamin supplements as I wanted to reduce variables while I got to the bottom of why I was getting red eye. B2 deficiency was mentioned on the internet as a cause of ocular rosacea, however, adding it didn’t seem to help. B vitamins support many pathways - helpful and unhelpful. Supplements, even if there is a deficiency, can have unintended consequences I think. I’ve now got a number of examples of this. Perhaps food is the answer (Tim says this @tim-2). Carnivore diet must be high niacin and high choline (another nutrient I’m concerned about) so could avoid the pitfalls of some other diets. However, I do think our microbiomes like plants! We need to keep our little friends happy too.
@jaj Jenny I am still doing a small ~5mg Niacin dose every other day, can't say I have seen any super positive reaction. Sleep is going ok, I do have super vivid dreams lately though.
Approach has been to take Niacin with zinc(30mg), B6(5mg), B1(25mg), Biotin(125mcg), B5(500mg), Lactoferrin(5mg)
B5 seems very helpful to me, always has a good affect on my skin quality.
@orion Glad you’ve found a nice balance. The B6 supports dreaming I’ve think. Be careful about supplementing B1 without B2, I've heard it can induce a B2 deficiency (Elliot Overton). I’ve got a link somewhere about B5 supporting ALDH which could be a help. The Bs do so many things. They are tricky but very important. I do think microbiome health is key for making the full complement.