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Paul Saladino
Quote from Jiří on March 20, 2025, 12:26 pm@tricky Athletes will do anything to be the best. If they would be better while in ketosis everyone would be in ketosis. The reality is exact opposite. They are pushing more and more carbs now it is even in numbers up to 150-200g par hour.. So feel free to show me at least one top PRO cyclist, marathon runner, Ironman athlete etc.. on highest level who is competing with the best in the world in ketosis. Until then this conversation is pointless. It is debating if bigfoot exist or not.. Just pls don't post here some average athlete again.. I am not saying that you can't ride a bike while on ketosis. I am saying you can't compete at races like Tour de France while in ketosis..
Is it possible there can be new and promising ideas yet to be heavily adopted?
@jeremy "Is it possible there can be new and promising ideas yet to be heavily adopted?"
Well if the competitions changes from who is faster to who can survive without food long race than you will see much more athletes doing ketosis that's for sure. But I don't think that will happen. People want to see fast and intense races. Not slow and boring ultra ultra ultra long races.. You simply don't understand human physiology and I am really tired of that. Go write what you are writing here to best athletes in the world. That they are doing it wrong. That they should eat just eggs and bacon before the race and during just water with salt and they would be faster and do better.. lol
I've already agreed with you multiple times that the only way to win a competition at the most elite levels in many (not all) modern sports is to do what everyone else is doing - take in unnatural amounts of highly processed sugar products that they often don't have to carry themselves. This is the same pattern we've seen with other performance enhancing substances in sports like road cycling - if you want to win, you're forced to take the same shit as everyone else until it gets banned by a sports organization. Caffeine and isolated sugar are two highly processed performance enhancing substances that are still allowed.
I don't think you know who Tim Noakes is... He might be the most well-published exercise scientist in the US, and he spent most of his career telling people they NEEDED carbs to excel in athletics. He had some epiphanies mid-career that changed his mind about carbs, he had enough integrity to completely change his position based on new evidence, and he has been fighting back against carb dogma ever since by publishing new research that opposes the existing paradigm.
Just because you don't know elite athletes that are low-carb doesn't mean they don't exist. Same goes for old-aged healthy people on low-carb or keto diets. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. You do realize you personally interact with a meaningless fraction of the people on this earth, right? You are completely dependent on other people telling you about those billions you never interact with personally, and the information you receive is selective and highly filtered.
I don't follow any professional sports and am unable to provide names but I would bet Bart Kay, who is also an academic exercise physiologist who reportedly has trained many pro athletes, has a growing list of top level athletes on low-carb or keto diets. Maybe they're not placing first in their events, but neither are 99.999999% of the athletes mainlining sugar lol.
Quote from Jiří on March 20, 2025, 1:51 pm@tricky Bart Kay. LOL another relevant person when it comes to professional sports nutrition. Yeah sure.. You don't follow any pro sports. Why you keep talking about it? If don't argue with people about things that I don't know. Anyways I don't want to waste any more time(for me or you) with this debate...
The two most relevant people are Tim Noakes, presumably for South African athletes, and Paul Mason, presumably for Australian athletes. Mason I know has private clients but has not written a research study on sports performance, to my knowledge.
Quote from Jiří on March 20, 2025, 1:51 pm@tricky I don't want to waste any more time(for me or you) with this debate...
It's not a debate, it's you saying "it's obvious", and me giving you reasons it's not obvious, and you ignoring the reasons it's not obvious. It is a complete waste of time though!
@jeremy most relevant people for what. How many world champions they trained. Like I said will no longer respond to this. Believe in what you want guys at the end of the day it will change nothing. So why wasting time with this.. No more responds to you guys about this. Just so you know..
This fits perfectly into this high carb vs keto. Go argue with this guy LOL 😀 I stopped watching Mark(who is on steroids all the time btw) because I couldn't watch anymore how he is promoting pushing your body with exercise while starving yourself on keto diet and relying on stress hormones and stimulants like they all do with drinking coffee like water.. Not it seems he is finally somewhat more open minded and sees the reality more..
Quote from David on March 18, 2025, 3:31 pmThese are good questions. I could not find information regarding potential toxicity of UV-exposed vA degradation products. What is mentioned in the literature is that vA lessens erythema/sunburn, and it lessens DNA damage. Beyond the scientific evidence, I operate on the general assumption that God/evolution designed us to live outdoors, and that there are mechanisms in place that help us to do that. The fact that vA seems to be specifically tuned to absorb UVA and UVB, thereby protecting the DNA in our skin cells just makes sense to me from a teleological standpoint. However, it would be very poor design indeed if the breakdown products of vA had their own toxicity. My guess is that they don't, but if anybody finds evidence otherwise, please let me know.
Hey @david-3,
RE: "I could not find information regarding potential toxicity of UV-exposed vA degradation products. "
I my P4P eBook I discussed this paper.
Potential photoreaction pathways of retinoids leading to phototoxicity and tumor formation.
Photodecomposition and Phototoxicity of Natural Retinoids.
Tolleson WH, Cherng S-H, Xia Q, et al.
International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health. 2005;2(1):147-155.
Thanks Grant. What do you think about this paper: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14708621/
It seems to state the exact opposite. Hard to know what to think!