I needed to disable self sign-ups because I’ve been getting too many spam-type accounts. Thanks.

DiscussionLet's talk about it: Progress ReportsA common deterioration one year a …

Please to create posts and topics.

A common deterioration one year after starting a low-vitamin A diet?

#21 · January 11, 2026, 2:03 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 2:03 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 10, 2026, 11:47 pm

Quote from whatisaging on January 10, 2026, 6:23 pm

@joe2 Well there's more people who don't respond well to lowering vitamin A. An upstream toxin might be a better model for them.

Regarding eyesight, if I had to work within this theory of an upstream toxin, I'd say that the total improved lifestyle (restricted diet and blood donations) is lowering the iron burden on the body, rather than vitamin A in isolation. There's literature on the combination of iron and vitamin A being much worse for the eyes than vitamin A alone. Since bison has nontrivial beta carotene, there would still be just enough vitamin A for the eyes to function after 10 years, but without that iron burden.

How many of us eat a low vitamin A diet like Grant's? How many of us eat what we call a low vitamin A diet as it is much lower than what we previously ate?

That is one confounding factor.

How many of us eat a number of other toxins via food, pharma, supplements and plain old crap like Mike Stone?

That is an infinite number of confounding factors that compound on each other.

Feels like everyone else's experience gets the benefit of the doubt when we declare that depleting vitamin A does not improve health. Grant's experience on the other hand gets strawman and gaslit arguments all over in spite of the obvious truth that the guy has done something inexplicable by previous religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Also, the rationalization of vitamin A intake helping Grant's eyes during the last 11 years is weak especially considering the idea of a lack of iron burden. How much more iron does bison have than beef? Or any other meat for that matter?

https://www.canadianbison.ca/consumers/why-bison/nutritional-value

Nuitritional Value of Bison Meat | Canadian Bison Association

Indeed, there are confounding factors. Just like how if people only eat meat, rice, and some beans and donate blood, then this lifestyle change is not the same as reducing vitamin A alone.

Regarding iron, you are bringing up bison vs beef, as if blood donations are not part of the picture.

I would say that everyone's experiences are valid with the caveat that they have obvious limitations, so what we can conclude from any of this is limited. That's why it's good to discuss theories and try different things, and why I shared the above thyroid stuff.

If old phlebotomist memory serves, iron levels are affected by red blood cell and whole blood donations. Plasma donations much less so if at all. Our plasma donors required iron levels were much lower than red cell donor requirements.

Agreed that other factors in Grant's dietary changes could have influenced his improvements as much or more than vitamin A depletion. Given what he wrote about his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 10, 2026, 11:47 pm

Quote from whatisaging on January 10, 2026, 6:23 pm

@joe2 Well there's more people who don't respond well to lowering vitamin A. An upstream toxin might be a better model for them.

Regarding eyesight, if I had to work within this theory of an upstream toxin, I'd say that the total improved lifestyle (restricted diet and blood donations) is lowering the iron burden on the body, rather than vitamin A in isolation. There's literature on the combination of iron and vitamin A being much worse for the eyes than vitamin A alone. Since bison has nontrivial beta carotene, there would still be just enough vitamin A for the eyes to function after 10 years, but without that iron burden.

How many of us eat a low vitamin A diet like Grant's? How many of us eat what we call a low vitamin A diet as it is much lower than what we previously ate?

That is one confounding factor.

How many of us eat a number of other toxins via food, pharma, supplements and plain old crap like Mike Stone?

That is an infinite number of confounding factors that compound on each other.

Feels like everyone else's experience gets the benefit of the doubt when we declare that depleting vitamin A does not improve health. Grant's experience on the other hand gets strawman and gaslit arguments all over in spite of the obvious truth that the guy has done something inexplicable by previous religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Also, the rationalization of vitamin A intake helping Grant's eyes during the last 11 years is weak especially considering the idea of a lack of iron burden. How much more iron does bison have than beef? Or any other meat for that matter?

https://www.canadianbison.ca/consumers/why-bison/nutritional-value

Nuitritional Value of Bison Meat | Canadian Bison Association

Indeed, there are confounding factors. Just like how if people only eat meat, rice, and some beans and donate blood, then this lifestyle change is not the same as reducing vitamin A alone.

Regarding iron, you are bringing up bison vs beef, as if blood donations are not part of the picture.

I would say that everyone's experiences are valid with the caveat that they have obvious limitations, so what we can conclude from any of this is limited. That's why it's good to discuss theories and try different things, and why I shared the above thyroid stuff.

If old phlebotomist memory serves, iron levels are affected by red blood cell and whole blood donations. Plasma donations much less so if at all. Our plasma donors required iron levels were much lower than red cell donor requirements.

Agreed that other factors in Grant's dietary changes could have influenced his improvements as much or more than vitamin A depletion. Given what he wrote about his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

#22 · January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 2:03 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 10, 2026, 11:47 pm

Quote from whatisaging on January 10, 2026, 6:23 pm

@joe2 Well there's more people who don't respond well to lowering vitamin A. An upstream toxin might be a better model for them.

Regarding eyesight, if I had to work within this theory of an upstream toxin, I'd say that the total improved lifestyle (restricted diet and blood donations) is lowering the iron burden on the body, rather than vitamin A in isolation. There's literature on the combination of iron and vitamin A being much worse for the eyes than vitamin A alone. Since bison has nontrivial beta carotene, there would still be just enough vitamin A for the eyes to function after 10 years, but without that iron burden.

How many of us eat a low vitamin A diet like Grant's? How many of us eat what we call a low vitamin A diet as it is much lower than what we previously ate?

That is one confounding factor.

How many of us eat a number of other toxins via food, pharma, supplements and plain old crap like Mike Stone?

That is an infinite number of confounding factors that compound on each other.

Feels like everyone else's experience gets the benefit of the doubt when we declare that depleting vitamin A does not improve health. Grant's experience on the other hand gets strawman and gaslit arguments all over in spite of the obvious truth that the guy has done something inexplicable by previous religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Also, the rationalization of vitamin A intake helping Grant's eyes during the last 11 years is weak especially considering the idea of a lack of iron burden. How much more iron does bison have than beef? Or any other meat for that matter?

https://www.canadianbison.ca/consumers/why-bison/nutritional-value

Nuitritional Value of Bison Meat | Canadian Bison Association

Indeed, there are confounding factors. Just like how if people only eat meat, rice, and some beans and donate blood, then this lifestyle change is not the same as reducing vitamin A alone.

Regarding iron, you are bringing up bison vs beef, as if blood donations are not part of the picture.

I would say that everyone's experiences are valid with the caveat that they have obvious limitations, so what we can conclude from any of this is limited. That's why it's good to discuss theories and try different things, and why I shared the above thyroid stuff.

If old phlebotomist memory serves, iron levels are affected by red blood cell and whole blood donations. Plasma donations much less so if at all. Our plasma donors required iron levels were much lower than red cell donor requirements.

Agreed that other factors in Grant's dietary changes could have influenced his improvements as much or more than vitamin A depletion. Given what he wrote about his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 2:03 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 10, 2026, 11:47 pm

Quote from whatisaging on January 10, 2026, 6:23 pm

@joe2 Well there's more people who don't respond well to lowering vitamin A. An upstream toxin might be a better model for them.

Regarding eyesight, if I had to work within this theory of an upstream toxin, I'd say that the total improved lifestyle (restricted diet and blood donations) is lowering the iron burden on the body, rather than vitamin A in isolation. There's literature on the combination of iron and vitamin A being much worse for the eyes than vitamin A alone. Since bison has nontrivial beta carotene, there would still be just enough vitamin A for the eyes to function after 10 years, but without that iron burden.

How many of us eat a low vitamin A diet like Grant's? How many of us eat what we call a low vitamin A diet as it is much lower than what we previously ate?

That is one confounding factor.

How many of us eat a number of other toxins via food, pharma, supplements and plain old crap like Mike Stone?

That is an infinite number of confounding factors that compound on each other.

Feels like everyone else's experience gets the benefit of the doubt when we declare that depleting vitamin A does not improve health. Grant's experience on the other hand gets strawman and gaslit arguments all over in spite of the obvious truth that the guy has done something inexplicable by previous religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Also, the rationalization of vitamin A intake helping Grant's eyes during the last 11 years is weak especially considering the idea of a lack of iron burden. How much more iron does bison have than beef? Or any other meat for that matter?

https://www.canadianbison.ca/consumers/why-bison/nutritional-value

Nuitritional Value of Bison Meat | Canadian Bison Association

Indeed, there are confounding factors. Just like how if people only eat meat, rice, and some beans and donate blood, then this lifestyle change is not the same as reducing vitamin A alone.

Regarding iron, you are bringing up bison vs beef, as if blood donations are not part of the picture.

I would say that everyone's experiences are valid with the caveat that they have obvious limitations, so what we can conclude from any of this is limited. That's why it's good to discuss theories and try different things, and why I shared the above thyroid stuff.

If old phlebotomist memory serves, iron levels are affected by red blood cell and whole blood donations. Plasma donations much less so if at all. Our plasma donors required iron levels were much lower than red cell donor requirements.

Agreed that other factors in Grant's dietary changes could have influenced his improvements as much or more than vitamin A depletion. Given what he wrote about his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

grapes and Hermes have reacted to this post.

#23 · January 11, 2026, 3:10 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 3:10 am

Quote from Jiří on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

@joe2 the biggest problem with Grant is that we have almost no data apart from blood levels of vit A which if I am correct he never had toxic level in the blood?

So very hard to tell what really was/is going on. The diet rich in zinc and protein and low in other potential toxic compounds served him well at least at the beginning where is fixed all his major health issues. That's for sure.

I think that with vit A is it the same as with most micronutrients like iron or copper. That we need extremely small amount. The body is simply build more for dealing with low stores than with dealing with excess of stored stuff. I think that because Grant is getting hardly any sun or because he is not pushing his metabolism up by any means basically. His body needs for vit A are extremely low at this point. If he would start living with Paul Saladino, in Costa Rica, doing activities he is doing maybe the issues would rise very fast. It is like when you are low in micronutrients needed for all kinds of things, but because you are hypothyroid you don't notice any issues, because the body is using so little of those micronutrients. But as soon you start to take thyroid and you speed up your metabolism you start to have all kinds of issues. Because the body is speeding up and runts out of those micronutrients fast. SO you experience stuff like hair loss, teeth, bone issues whatever.

The problem with Grant and his experiment that he is doing on himself is that he is not doing any testing. We have no idea what is going on with him.

You think any mainstream medical/health/diet people will take him seriously when we have no data from him? Apart from the fact the he shows up once ever 3 years on some podcast and tells I am still here not blind?

So because of that I simply can't tell. Like I said based on from what I know I think his metabolism is extremely slow. Almost like in some hibernation mode and so vit A deficiency is probably the last think that would show up as some main health concern.

So unless we see extensive blood work from him we can only speculate.

Not to mention Grant is invested in this very deep. It is his life work at this point. Do you think there is any possibility that he would admit issues and that maybe he was wrong about stuff?

Like I said his health status is one big mystery. We don't know anything. We know for sure that this "you need RDA of vit A otherwise you will get blind in couple of months" is absolute bullshit and the range of how much vit A you can handle without any health issues is crazy wide. Like I said based on metabolic rate and other factors. But that's about it..

Grant is not helping much with the answers now due to the lack of any data about what is going on with him and because of his very restricted diet in terms of micronutrients and calories as well. Even if he had issues it would be hard to tell what is causing what.

Simply if anything happens to Grant(hopefully not) we would have no idea what or why..

That biggest problem is also one of our biggest strengths. It eliminates a raft of confounding factors. Factors that we see far more often than not in everyone who tries low vA and any other diet for that matter.

That biggest problem is keeping it simple. That is the basis of applied science.

Experience in diet, experimenting and phlebotomy - blood tests are infinitely less accurate and less useful than labs, insurers and the entire medical pharmaceutical industrial complex pretends. We are consumers of decades of marketing masquerading as science.

Elizabeth Holmes is the rule not the exception. Once a drug, a device or a test protocol gets past regulators it takes years and usually decades to prove it was all a lie. Vioxx took ten years and 160,000 lives. DPT took like 20 years. TDAP is still wrecking people while immune from prosecution. Measles vaccine has killed magnitudes of order more people than measles for decades. Cormen-Drosten paper selling the lies of PCR tests for sarscov2 is brazen lies all the way down and still the dogmatic basis for that entire industrial international lie. That lie from 2020 looks like it will run at least until 2032 before exposure.

Be sure that the directors at Theranos knew who and what Elizabeth Holmes was about.  Henry Kissinger, Jim Mattis, George Shultz, Richard Kovacevich, William Perry, William Foege and Larry Ellison are not new to such reindeer games. Think Enron. Or TPUSA today. Sure the lies and frauds eventually come out. The profits get taken and protected in shell companies long before that time comes. Even when these whale investors lose money they make more money. How these companies and our resultant media and culture work out is the rule not the exception.

Point being that speculating about what is the optimum metabolic rate is problematic at best given that foundation of lies our schooling is based on. Given whatever Grant's metabolic rate is, I venture a guess that it is one to be envied given his health and performance these last 11 years.

I am less inclined to dismiss or discount Grant's published results and experience. This is hardly his life's work. It is a breakthrough where corrupt scientists could not smother the truth any longer. But the man hardly dedicated his life to it. He had to make a living. He recognized the limits of what he could do. Given some of the conversations I had with and about him from all directions and people, I am impressed with fact that he is more than willing to publish on whatever happens when it is pertinent.

However politely stated, it is inappropriate and inaccurate to presume that he puts his thumb on the scale in favor of his theory. Especially considering his careful lack of return on invested time in this blog and elsewhere. There too I think he is considering other factors. Niacin toxicity from years of ingesting niacin fortified foods might have been a factor. All of this aside, vitamin A depletion is the most plausible and mostly likely cause of his, of mine and of a growing group of peoples' improvements.

This reminds me of another anecdotal experience regarding metabolism. In a past life I screened (short form brief physical examination) blood donors before their donations. Probably screened 24,000. Back then, we required donors to keep a resting heart rate between 60 and 100. Now it is more like 50 to 100. Have seen donors climb 4 steps into the bus and require 15 minutes of sitting to get their resting pulse back down to 120. Did a blood drive at a high school. Big guy in his 40's ran up to my desk and sat down. Demanded I take his pulse immediately. It is usually one of the last things done in a 10 minute process. 6'5" guy, about 250 pounds, ripped sat there jumping up and down in the chair bouncing his feet up and down. Kept demanding I go.

Ok. Grabbed radial artery. Easy to do on giant guy. Thought I could not find it though. He told me to wait. Sure enough, I had it the first time. It was just quiet. Huge blood vessel. Thump was huge. AND SLOW. Guy was pulling like a 25. He started laughing at my expression. Said he gets that alot. Kept bouncing asked what I got. Right away I knew what this was. Told him to start jumping more and faster and started over.

Guy was struggling to get his pulse up to donate. We got it to 50. Then called the medical director to get him a waiver to donate as an unusually healthy athlete. Then he sat back and we finished rest of the process. Had him tell me the story. Triathlete. Seriously high level guy. His normal resting pulse runs from 15 to 25. Said he ran stairs behind the gym we held the blood drive in to get his pulse up. He ran like 20 flights of stairs before he sat down at my desk.

Took his pulse again after our talk for fun. He was not kidding. It was 15. But each stroke felt like a half cup flowed under my finger. Guy was just this big powerful laid back bear of a man. Hilarious guy.

Irony of it is the rule in our society. Vast majority of my peer phlebotomists and bosses were obese and pre-diabetic. 10% morbidly obese and prescribed drugs for diabetes. Majority of them speculated that this guy was sick because of his training. They took his pulse as a sign of disease. They did not want him to donate. Guy filled a 500ml bag in record time with some of the healthiest looking blood I ever saw.

Your speculation that Grant's health and his outlined experience is questionable comes off similar to what those young ladies said about that triathlete. Most of them were ladies with a pulse well over 120 after a flight of stairs. They considered my pulse and blood pressure as a sure sign I needed meds and donuts and who knows whatever else. Whatever the case they were sure that their health journey was the norm to be emulated and adjusted to. Anything else was just foolish, radical and too risky.

Quote from Jiří on January 11, 2026, 12:41 am

@joe2 the biggest problem with Grant is that we have almost no data apart from blood levels of vit A which if I am correct he never had toxic level in the blood?

So very hard to tell what really was/is going on. The diet rich in zinc and protein and low in other potential toxic compounds served him well at least at the beginning where is fixed all his major health issues. That's for sure.

I think that with vit A is it the same as with most micronutrients like iron or copper. That we need extremely small amount. The body is simply build more for dealing with low stores than with dealing with excess of stored stuff. I think that because Grant is getting hardly any sun or because he is not pushing his metabolism up by any means basically. His body needs for vit A are extremely low at this point. If he would start living with Paul Saladino, in Costa Rica, doing activities he is doing maybe the issues would rise very fast. It is like when you are low in micronutrients needed for all kinds of things, but because you are hypothyroid you don't notice any issues, because the body is using so little of those micronutrients. But as soon you start to take thyroid and you speed up your metabolism you start to have all kinds of issues. Because the body is speeding up and runts out of those micronutrients fast. SO you experience stuff like hair loss, teeth, bone issues whatever.

The problem with Grant and his experiment that he is doing on himself is that he is not doing any testing. We have no idea what is going on with him.

You think any mainstream medical/health/diet people will take him seriously when we have no data from him? Apart from the fact the he shows up once ever 3 years on some podcast and tells I am still here not blind?

So because of that I simply can't tell. Like I said based on from what I know I think his metabolism is extremely slow. Almost like in some hibernation mode and so vit A deficiency is probably the last think that would show up as some main health concern.

So unless we see extensive blood work from him we can only speculate.

Not to mention Grant is invested in this very deep. It is his life work at this point. Do you think there is any possibility that he would admit issues and that maybe he was wrong about stuff?

Like I said his health status is one big mystery. We don't know anything. We know for sure that this "you need RDA of vit A otherwise you will get blind in couple of months" is absolute bullshit and the range of how much vit A you can handle without any health issues is crazy wide. Like I said based on metabolic rate and other factors. But that's about it..

Grant is not helping much with the answers now due to the lack of any data about what is going on with him and because of his very restricted diet in terms of micronutrients and calories as well. Even if he had issues it would be hard to tell what is causing what.

Simply if anything happens to Grant(hopefully not) we would have no idea what or why..

That biggest problem is also one of our biggest strengths. It eliminates a raft of confounding factors. Factors that we see far more often than not in everyone who tries low vA and any other diet for that matter.

That biggest problem is keeping it simple. That is the basis of applied science.

Experience in diet, experimenting and phlebotomy - blood tests are infinitely less accurate and less useful than labs, insurers and the entire medical pharmaceutical industrial complex pretends. We are consumers of decades of marketing masquerading as science.

Elizabeth Holmes is the rule not the exception. Once a drug, a device or a test protocol gets past regulators it takes years and usually decades to prove it was all a lie. Vioxx took ten years and 160,000 lives. DPT took like 20 years. TDAP is still wrecking people while immune from prosecution. Measles vaccine has killed magnitudes of order more people than measles for decades. Cormen-Drosten paper selling the lies of PCR tests for sarscov2 is brazen lies all the way down and still the dogmatic basis for that entire industrial international lie. That lie from 2020 looks like it will run at least until 2032 before exposure.

Be sure that the directors at Theranos knew who and what Elizabeth Holmes was about. Henry Kissinger, Jim Mattis, George Shultz, Richard Kovacevich, William Perry, William Foege and Larry Ellison are not new to such reindeer games. Think Enron. Or TPUSA today. Sure the lies and frauds eventually come out. The profits get taken and protected in shell companies long before that time comes. Even when these whale investors lose money they make more money. How these companies and our resultant media and culture work out is the rule not the exception.

Point being that speculating about what is the optimum metabolic rate is problematic at best given that foundation of lies our schooling is based on. Given whatever Grant's metabolic rate is, I venture a guess that it is one to be envied given his health and performance these last 11 years.

I am less inclined to dismiss or discount Grant's published results and experience. This is hardly his life's work. It is a breakthrough where corrupt scientists could not smother the truth any longer. But the man hardly dedicated his life to it. He had to make a living. He recognized the limits of what he could do. Given some of the conversations I had with and about him from all directions and people, I am impressed with fact that he is more than willing to publish on whatever happens when it is pertinent.

However politely stated, it is inappropriate and inaccurate to presume that he puts his thumb on the scale in favor of his theory. Especially considering his careful lack of return on invested time in this blog and elsewhere. There too I think he is considering other factors. Niacin toxicity from years of ingesting niacin fortified foods might have been a factor. All of this aside, vitamin A depletion is the most plausible and mostly likely cause of his, of mine and of a growing group of peoples' improvements.

This reminds me of another anecdotal experience regarding metabolism. In a past life I screened (short form brief physical examination) blood donors before their donations. Probably screened 24,000. Back then, we required donors to keep a resting heart rate between 60 and 100. Now it is more like 50 to 100. Have seen donors climb 4 steps into the bus and require 15 minutes of sitting to get their resting pulse back down to 120. Did a blood drive at a high school. Big guy in his 40's ran up to my desk and sat down. Demanded I take his pulse immediately. It is usually one of the last things done in a 10 minute process. 6'5" guy, about 250 pounds, ripped sat there jumping up and down in the chair bouncing his feet up and down. Kept demanding I go.

Ok. Grabbed radial artery. Easy to do on giant guy. Thought I could not find it though. He told me to wait. Sure enough, I had it the first time. It was just quiet. Huge blood vessel. Thump was huge. AND SLOW. Guy was pulling like a 25. He started laughing at my expression. Said he gets that alot. Kept bouncing asked what I got. Right away I knew what this was. Told him to start jumping more and faster and started over.

Guy was struggling to get his pulse up to donate. We got it to 50. Then called the medical director to get him a waiver to donate as an unusually healthy athlete. Then he sat back and we finished rest of the process. Had him tell me the story. Triathlete. Seriously high level guy. His normal resting pulse runs from 15 to 25. Said he ran stairs behind the gym we held the blood drive in to get his pulse up. He ran like 20 flights of stairs before he sat down at my desk.

Took his pulse again after our talk for fun. He was not kidding. It was 15. But each stroke felt like a half cup flowed under my finger. Guy was just this big powerful laid back bear of a man. Hilarious guy.

Irony of it is the rule in our society. Vast majority of my peer phlebotomists and bosses were obese and pre-diabetic. 10% morbidly obese and prescribed drugs for diabetes. Majority of them speculated that this guy was sick because of his training. They took his pulse as a sign of disease. They did not want him to donate. Guy filled a 500ml bag in record time with some of the healthiest looking blood I ever saw.

Your speculation that Grant's health and his outlined experience is questionable comes off similar to what those young ladies said about that triathlete. Most of them were ladies with a pulse well over 120 after a flight of stairs. They considered my pulse and blood pressure as a sure sign I needed meds and donuts and who knows whatever else. Whatever the case they were sure that their health journey was the norm to be emulated and adjusted to. Anything else was just foolish, radical and too risky.

grapes has reacted to this post.

#24 · January 11, 2026, 3:47 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 3:47 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quoterevious religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Alsbout his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

Have known a few folk with iron issues who's doctors instructed them to donate. One old friend could not eat beef without turning grey. Have known many more who donated the maximum for red cells and whole blood at every opportunity who ate beef. Their diet other than beef sucked. Their iron levels were routinely well above minimums. Uniformly, those with iron issues had messed up livers. That old friend drank the majority of his calories for decades. Sure some claimed that iron messed up their livers. Um pretty sure that was an inverted view of reality. For sure iron hurt their liver at that point in life. Blaming it as the cause of their liver problems was much less likely to be accurate given what else went on in their lives.

Given my last 4 decades experience in this and other diet paradigms, it is a safe bet that more than 60-70% of those attempting this lifestyle are not coming close to what defines a low vA diet let alone a healthy version of it. Can not count how many times in 12 years of keto, someone told me how they were eating keto as they munched down a whole pizza with a pitcher of beer or 2 pieces of chocolate cake or,.........whatever. Same was true as a vegetarian. Even today, I meet people who insist they are vegetarian as they slam down a big bowl of chicken alfredo. Or they claim they only eat organic and healthy meals as they slam down a family size bag of cheetos with a liter of mountain dew. They all have excuses like oh well it's just a snack or a cheat meal or a cheat day.

In other words, few but the easiest paradigms get better than 20% compliance. Like Mike Stone's "Eat for Heat" idea. That probably got 90% compliance. Or Ray Peat's? Yeh how hard it that to slam down sugar and fat?

As far as success rates for all paradigms? Diet and or pharmaceutical interventions? Any program that gets better than 15% success rate from their clients is rocking. Check out the success rates of doctors prescribing statins or SSRI's or any other drug. Take a look at success rates of Crossfit coaches who advocated keto and or paleo. Or the success rates of all the different health coaches. Anyone coming close to 30% of their clients claiming success is at the top of their game and getting famous quickly.

Spot on observation. Dang near impossible to know exactly what is going on. We are the data. Dubious that we are going to count ourselves accurately either. Besides the confounding factors, what are the motivations to share our results now, next year or in 5 or 10 years? Sure a few of us will. But vast majority of us are going to move on and rarely look back.

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quoterevious religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Alsbout his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

Have known a few folk with iron issues who's doctors instructed them to donate. One old friend could not eat beef without turning grey. Have known many more who donated the maximum for red cells and whole blood at every opportunity who ate beef. Their diet other than beef sucked. Their iron levels were routinely well above minimums. Uniformly, those with iron issues had messed up livers. That old friend drank the majority of his calories for decades. Sure some claimed that iron messed up their livers. Um pretty sure that was an inverted view of reality. For sure iron hurt their liver at that point in life. Blaming it as the cause of their liver problems was much less likely to be accurate given what else went on in their lives.

Given my last 4 decades experience in this and other diet paradigms, it is a safe bet that more than 60-70% of those attempting this lifestyle are not coming close to what defines a low vA diet let alone a healthy version of it. Can not count how many times in 12 years of keto, someone told me how they were eating keto as they munched down a whole pizza with a pitcher of beer or 2 pieces of chocolate cake or,.........whatever. Same was true as a vegetarian. Even today, I meet people who insist they are vegetarian as they slam down a big bowl of chicken alfredo. Or they claim they only eat organic and healthy meals as they slam down a family size bag of cheetos with a liter of mountain dew. They all have excuses like oh well it's just a snack or a cheat meal or a cheat day.

In other words, few but the easiest paradigms get better than 20% compliance. Like Mike Stone's "Eat for Heat" idea. That probably got 90% compliance. Or Ray Peat's? Yeh how hard it that to slam down sugar and fat?

As far as success rates for all paradigms? Diet and or pharmaceutical interventions? Any program that gets better than 15% success rate from their clients is rocking. Check out the success rates of doctors prescribing statins or SSRI's or any other drug. Take a look at success rates of Crossfit coaches who advocated keto and or paleo. Or the success rates of all the different health coaches. Anyone coming close to 30% of their clients claiming success is at the top of their game and getting famous quickly.

Spot on observation. Dang near impossible to know exactly what is going on. We are the data. Dubious that we are going to count ourselves accurately either. Besides the confounding factors, what are the motivations to share our results now, next year or in 5 or 10 years? Sure a few of us will. But vast majority of us are going to move on and rarely look back.

#25 · January 11, 2026, 4:14 am

@joe2 all I am saying is that I can't be sure if Grant is really doing so amazing as he is saying.(that his body is still doing better and better even after the period he fixed his major health issues) But I know that he is all in with his theory. So at this point it would be really hard pill to swallow to admit he is wrong. I am not saying that he is wrong, but there is the possibility. It could be this "frog in boiling water theory" in his case and because we don't ANY data apart from some podcast once every 3 years where he doesn't look like person with good level of energy to be honest.. I really don't know how you can be co confident in this.

#26 · January 11, 2026, 4:21 am

There's a recent interesting post on this by @thepowerofozone on twitter which discusses the situation more successfully than I did.

https://x.com/thepowerofozone/status/2010309495977570815?s=20

#27 · January 11, 2026, 4:31 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 4:31 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 3:47 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quoterevious religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Alsbout his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

Have known a few folk with iron issues who's doctors instructed them to donate. One old friend could not eat beef without turning grey. Have known many more who donated the maximum for red cells and whole blood at every opportunity who ate beef. Their diet other than beef sucked. Their iron levels were routinely well above minimums. Uniformly, those with iron issues had messed up livers. That old friend drank the majority of his calories for decades. Sure some claimed that iron messed up their livers. Um pretty sure that was an inverted view of reality. For sure iron hurt their liver at that point in life. Blaming it as the cause of their liver problems was much less likely to be accurate given what else went on in their lives.

Given my last 4 decades experience in this and other diet paradigms, it is a safe bet that more than 60-70% of those attempting this lifestyle are not coming close to what defines a low vA diet let alone a healthy version of it. Can not count how many times in 12 years of keto, someone told me how they were eating keto as they munched down a whole pizza with a pitcher of beer or 2 pieces of chocolate cake or,.........whatever. Same was true as a vegetarian. Even today, I meet people who insist they are vegetarian as they slam down a big bowl of chicken alfredo. Or they claim they only eat organic and healthy meals as they slam down a family size bag of cheetos with a liter of mountain dew. They all have excuses like oh well it's just a snack or a cheat meal or a cheat day.

In other words, few but the easiest paradigms get better than 20% compliance. Like Mike Stone's "Eat for Heat" idea. That probably got 90% compliance. Or Ray Peat's? Yeh how hard it that to slam down sugar and fat?

As far as success rates for all paradigms? Diet and or pharmaceutical interventions? Any program that gets better than 15% success rate from their clients is rocking. Check out the success rates of doctors prescribing statins or SSRI's or any other drug. Take a look at success rates of Crossfit coaches who advocated keto and or paleo. Or the success rates of all the different health coaches. Anyone coming close to 30% of their clients claiming success is at the top of their game and getting famous quickly.

Spot on observation. Dang near impossible to know exactly what is going on. We are the data. Dubious that we are going to count ourselves accurately either. Besides the confounding factors, what are the motivations to share our results now, next year or in 5 or 10 years? Sure a few of us will. But vast majority of us are going to move on and rarely look back.

Regarding iron, I agree that those with iron issues probably had liver or other issues, since it's an essential nutrient and hard to see as bad by itself. What seems more fundamental to me is aluminum, lead, and the other toxic metals. They are not essential and are basically just poisonous garbage from modern society's pollution. The issue is that aluminum, for example, can derange iron storage

https://x.com/MetalsBrah/status/1974669529235239376?s=20

and can also lead to iron overload, hence all kinds of issues in the body

https://x.com/MetalsBrah/status/1933962046090973415?s=20

So this is kind of what I'm saying by an upstream toxin having downstream consequences on further metabolism of iron, and then maybe on vitamin A.

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 3:47 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 2:24 am

Quoterevious religious er I mean sciency beliefs.

Alsbout his experience, vitamin A depletion looks far and a way the strongest influence though. At this point the onus is on speculators to come up with better explanations than what Grant has provided here.

Agreed that further theorizing is invaluable. Worth noting that we might want to reconsider most if not all previously believed consensus science. Vast experience personally and throughout history is when one lie is uncovered infinitely more lies are hiding under similar camouflage.

There are both plasma and whole blood donations involved (https://ggenereux.blog/2022/08/11/eight-year-update/), it appears starting 2020 (https://ggenereux.blog/2020/08/29/six-year-update/).

There are 60-70% of people who attempt this lifestyle that don't do well, so I don't think it's at all clear that vitamin A alone is the best explanation. If other factors can this easily mess the diet up, then purely vitamin A might not be these people's main issue.

I do think that vitamin A is a big part of the answer though, based on everything Grant wrote. Also my own experiences.

So I instead think that the onus is on everyone to do better, since the data is just too limited to say we fully understand what's going on.

Have known a few folk with iron issues who's doctors instructed them to donate. One old friend could not eat beef without turning grey. Have known many more who donated the maximum for red cells and whole blood at every opportunity who ate beef. Their diet other than beef sucked. Their iron levels were routinely well above minimums. Uniformly, those with iron issues had messed up livers. That old friend drank the majority of his calories for decades. Sure some claimed that iron messed up their livers. Um pretty sure that was an inverted view of reality. For sure iron hurt their liver at that point in life. Blaming it as the cause of their liver problems was much less likely to be accurate given what else went on in their lives.

Given my last 4 decades experience in this and other diet paradigms, it is a safe bet that more than 60-70% of those attempting this lifestyle are not coming close to what defines a low vA diet let alone a healthy version of it. Can not count how many times in 12 years of keto, someone told me how they were eating keto as they munched down a whole pizza with a pitcher of beer or 2 pieces of chocolate cake or,.........whatever. Same was true as a vegetarian. Even today, I meet people who insist they are vegetarian as they slam down a big bowl of chicken alfredo. Or they claim they only eat organic and healthy meals as they slam down a family size bag of cheetos with a liter of mountain dew. They all have excuses like oh well it's just a snack or a cheat meal or a cheat day.

In other words, few but the easiest paradigms get better than 20% compliance. Like Mike Stone's "Eat for Heat" idea. That probably got 90% compliance. Or Ray Peat's? Yeh how hard it that to slam down sugar and fat?

As far as success rates for all paradigms? Diet and or pharmaceutical interventions? Any program that gets better than 15% success rate from their clients is rocking. Check out the success rates of doctors prescribing statins or SSRI's or any other drug. Take a look at success rates of Crossfit coaches who advocated keto and or paleo. Or the success rates of all the different health coaches. Anyone coming close to 30% of their clients claiming success is at the top of their game and getting famous quickly.

Spot on observation. Dang near impossible to know exactly what is going on. We are the data. Dubious that we are going to count ourselves accurately either. Besides the confounding factors, what are the motivations to share our results now, next year or in 5 or 10 years? Sure a few of us will. But vast majority of us are going to move on and rarely look back.

Regarding iron, I agree that those with iron issues probably had liver or other issues, since it's an essential nutrient and hard to see as bad by itself. What seems more fundamental to me is aluminum, lead, and the other toxic metals. They are not essential and are basically just poisonous garbage from modern society's pollution. The issue is that aluminum, for example, can derange iron storage

https://x.com/MetalsBrah/status/1974669529235239376?s=20

and can also lead to iron overload, hence all kinds of issues in the body

https://x.com/MetalsBrah/status/1933962046090973415?s=20

So this is kind of what I'm saying by an upstream toxin having downstream consequences on further metabolism of iron, and then maybe on vitamin A.

#28 · January 11, 2026, 4:34 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 4:21 am

There's a recent interesting post on this by @thepowerofozone on twitter which discusses the situation more successfully than I did.

https://x.com/thepowerofozone/status/2010309495977570815?s=20

My take on Paola is that she is a serious bad faith actor. Have seen her persist for weeks making unfounded and impossible claims against others. She only stopped when proven wrong and repeatedly called out by a group of us for weeks. She never did admit she was wrong. She just stopped making the wrong claims.

Her post above has more holes in its claims and logic than what you wrote. I disagree with you. I think you did a far better and more honest job writing on topic.

#29 · January 11, 2026, 4:43 am

@joe2 Do you think Grant would admit that he was wrong with "vit A is just a toxin" at this point when he is all in with this theory for so many years? Just asking..

#30 · January 11, 2026, 4:55 am

Quote from Joe2 on January 11, 2026, 4:34 am

Quote from whatisaging on January 11, 2026, 4:21 am

There's a recent interesting post on this by @thepowerofozone on twitter which discusses the situation more successfully than I did.

https://x.com/thepowerofozone/status/2010309495977570815?s=20

My take on Paola is that she is a serious bad faith actor. Have seen her persist for weeks making unfounded and impossible claims against others. She only stopped when proven wrong and repeatedly called out by a group of us for weeks. She never did admit she was wrong. She just stopped making the wrong claims.

Her post above has more holes in its claims and logic than what you wrote. I disagree with you. I think you did a far better and more honest job writing on topic.

I'm a fan. While I've known her, she's only been a fountain of interesting research, and has been really helpful personally to me and others.

A common deterioration one year after starting a low-vitamin A diet?

Share this:

Like this: