I needed to disable self sign-ups because I’ve been getting too many spam-type accounts. Thanks.
Serious start:11 September 2019
I hope you are better soon.
Did you develop these symptoms while doing the Vitamin A Detox diet or did you have them before?
2.5 years into it is a long time and should have made you a lot better if it works for you. At least in my opinion.
The old-school carnivore diet of ribeye, salt and water works for many if things are out of control and you haven't identified the cause. If you eat grain finished beef, it is probably lower in vitamin A than many other diets.
@beata-2 I’m so sorry to hear how ill you are feeling.
I found much improved on the vA detox, however, my anxiety got worse and worse, so I’ve been down a number of rabbit holes to try and understand this. I don’t know if any of my discoveries could be at all relevant to you. They both involve the upregulation of pathways that should be helpful BUT there is some sort of block (genetic/epigenetic) so they lead to accumulation of toxic substances. Both could be induced by the vA detox imo.
First one is the heme pathway and porphyria. When a toxin requires detoxification the relevant CYP450 is induced. They are heme enzymes so the heme pathway gets upregulated. This is how it should work. However, this pathway involves 8 enzymes and if any are running slow the toxic intermediates porphyrins accumulate. Therefore a high amount of toxin (o think the vA detox could do this) can trigger porphyria in susceptible people. I think I have this issue. (Porphyrins block GABA receptors).
The second is NAD deficiency. ALDH required to detoxify vA has NAD as a co-factor. There are many other drains on this system too. When the body runs short of NAD the tryptophan de novo pathway gets induced. The ‘troublesome tryptophan’ pathway. This is prone to accumulate toxic intermediates such as quinolinic acid. I think this has happened to me.
I think I’ve got to the bottom of how the vA detox has made my anxiety worse. But the proof will be in the cure!
I don’t know if either of these pathway upregulations could be in any way relevant to you Beata but just in case I thought I’d share. The body is doing what it should but blocks in pathways are creating toxins.
Hi @orion yes the long covid/NAD deficiency group recommend low dose (50-100mg) nicotinic acid, as this should slow the ‘troublesome tryptophan’ pathway. So I’m doing that for the quinolinic acid problem. For the heme pathway blocks I’m focused on reducing heavy metals (lead, mercury) as they block the enzymes and increase porphyrins. I’m adding B6 as I have pyroluria. Without B6 glutamate can’t convert to GABA. I’m also doing a lot of magnesium sulphate baths. Magnesium helps quinolinic acid to NAD conversion. Sulphate helps detox mercury. That’s my current plan. I already feel a lot less anxious. Such a relief to have a plan!
@jaj Glad to hear you are finding some relief! Been a long time since I tested with B3 of the flushing type, tempted to test a smaller dose like you and see how I react. Niacinamide has always caused me negatives.
Quote from Max on February 16, 2022, 10:51 amI hope you are better soon.
Did you develop these symptoms while doing the Vitamin A Detox diet or did you have them before?
2.5 years into it is a long time and should have made you a lot better if it works for you. At least in my opinion.
Since starting the low vit. A diet I experienced many nice health improvements, like:
* strengthening of my digestive system (no more constipation or heartburn),
* smoothing of very deeply ridged nails,
* lower thyroid peroxidase antibodies (114 to 152 (on high fat/high liver carnivore) to 75 at present but still above the 0-34 range,
* lover dose of thyroid medication,
* more muscular strength.
There were no improvements in some aspects like
* stable angina,
* receding gums,
* slight life-long anxiety (which disappeared on the carnivore diet!)
* occasional difficulty falling asleep which got much worst recently
* tinnitus that started when they installed 5G tower 200 ft. away
* anosmia after a flu last September
The un-wellness I experience lately comes and goes. Today, for instance, I woke up easily and feel fine. Yesterday was not so. I seem to be very sensitive to changes in weather, rain brings on a headache, winds make me feel volatile, full moon brings on anxiety. As I write this I realise that this looks nuts! But here it is, me - a delicate flower shaken by the elements! 😶🌫️
Quote from Retinoicon on February 16, 2022, 10:56 am
The old-school carnivore diet of ribeye, salt and water works for many if things are out of control and you haven't identified the cause. If you eat grain finished beef, it is probably lower in vitamin A than many other diets.
I cannot tell you how many times I think about going back to the carnivore- especially when someone posts a video of a success story. But my carnivore days were a disaster and memory of it still lingers.
Since studying Karen Hurd and her rationale behind the soluble fibre in beans and it’s detoxifying and bile flow enhancing properties, I do not look forward to constipation, xanthelasma (that is slowly dissipating), high liver enzymes, insomnia from hell, extremely weak digestion (unable to eat anything but fresh lamb, unable to eat past 18:00), histamine issues, etc. that I experienced in high fat high / high liver carnivore. Would steaks and water be any different? It’s probably worth the try but I seem unable to be convinced enough to do it. So, I am torn in this regard and consider beans, meat and rice attractive (most of the time) and only a problem when certain mood strikes.
But after reading this you still think the carnivore is the best out there for me, please do convince me. 😳
Quote from Jenny on February 16, 2022, 11:18 am@beata-2 I’m so sorry to hear how ill you are feeling.
I found much improved on the vA detox, however, my anxiety got worse and worse, so I’ve been down a number of rabbit holes to try and understand this. I don’t know if any of my discoveries could be at all relevant to you. They both involve the upregulation of pathways that should be helpful BUT there is some sort of block (genetic/epigenetic) so they lead to accumulation of toxic substances. Both could be induced by the vA detox imo.
First one is the heme pathway and porphyria. When a toxin requires detoxification the relevant CYP450 is induced. They are heme enzymes so the heme pathway gets upregulated. This is how it should work. However, this pathway involves 8 enzymes and if any are running slow the toxic intermediates porphyrins accumulate. Therefore a high amount of toxin (o think the vA detox could do this) can trigger porphyria in susceptible people. I think I have this issue. (Porphyrins block GABA receptors).
The second is NAD deficiency. ALDH required to detoxify vA has NAD as a co-factor. There are many other drains on this system too. When the body runs short of NAD the tryptophan de novo pathway gets induced. The ‘troublesome tryptophan’ pathway. This is prone to accumulate toxic intermediates such as quinolinic acid. I think this has happened to me.
I think I’ve got to the bottom of how the vA detox has made my anxiety worse. But the proof will be in the cure!
I don’t know if either of these pathway upregulations could be in any way relevant to you Beata but just in case I thought I’d share. The body is doing what it should but blocks in pathways are creating toxins.
Jenny, this is all truly fascinating and in the past I was strongly predisposed to studying biochemistry and unpacking the processes of human body; the MTFHR polymorphism was my favourite.
Recently, I got interested in the German New Medicine and also Dr. Tom Cowan’s approach to health and illness, and perhaps this made me question everything I thought I knew. The body wants to be healthy and the symptoms are simply messages that something is in the way of health. The symptoms are a healing reaction and attempt to clear that which is unnecessary and damaging. Remove that which does not serve and observe healing.
Naturally finding the offenders is a long road as we seem to be surrounded by more and more toxins and technologies never properly tested to prove them safe. Eg. lately, our forever idiotic health authorities decided to increase to areas of water fluoridation in the UK. I cannot believe that in 21 century somebody still believes that putting extremely toxic substances in water will make people healthier!
Anyway, thank you for the info. I don’t doubt that there are many processes in my body that are screwed up one way or another, and the ALDH is lacking. Since low VA diet, I lost ability to drink any alcohol. I used to enjoy a 1/4 glass of wine on occasion. Now even thinking about it make is nauseous. I don’t seem to have any major symptoms of porphyria; a friend was pissing dark brown urine so I am familiar with it a bit.
What I seem to really want is lots of sunshine, clear air and water, no EMFs, a group of close friends and a loving family around me. Most are missing, so not hard to figure out why robust health is just around the corner.