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Influence of food on ADH and ALDH activity
Quote from El on December 31, 2023, 3:04 pmQuote from Inger on December 31, 2023, 1:12 pmQuote from El on December 31, 2023, 7:00 amQuote from Inger on December 31, 2023, 6:43 am
I recommend that you eat pears, asparagus, cucumber and drink a lot of sparkling water, green tea and black tea.and limon@el have you healed yourself on a diet like that? Would you share what your ailments was and what have healed so far? Because that would really interest me. I alwas need some practical proof something works = that it actually helped you.
those foods raise adh and aldh@el, but how do you know it will work in practice? Are you saying you have not healed yourself with this sort of diet? Because then it really has not that much value to me. It is a theory. If a food has one healing proponent to it does not mean it is going to be good for you to eat. It is like coffee. They say it has great healing things for the liver, but guess what, I feel way better off coffee or any stimulants. And that is what matters to me. It has to work in practice. Not in theory. I feel better in the long run without any stimulants. Not "drug-like" better, but for real, "deep to the bones"better.
If I was cured, I went on a diet with rice, beans and meat for a year and I had a lot of fatigue, pain, fever. I stopped taking beans and. rice. In a month I got better and I'm better than I've ever been in my life. about a kilo a day. of pears and oranges and green tea sparkling water and lemon. My liver enzymes have improved greatly in a month. beans made my liver enzymes worse
Did you have SIBO? A lot of gas? I wish tea was a cure for the liver, but I am not so sure. My Mom has loved black tea her whole adult life and still lost her gallbladder and has severe pollen allergies which is a sign of a clogged up liver. She doesn't eat very much fruit though. I think fruit can be a healthy way to get in carbs vs. rice if you have SIBO and sticky bile. Beans and rice could clog things up more.
@janelle525 what is her diet. The liver needs good amount of choline, protein, some fiber.. Also thyroid regulates liver function. Low thyroid function = low bile production and flow.. So iodine, selenium also very important.. Also high estrogen(estrogen dominance) is very common in females and that also creates cholestasis.. For that you need also protein, zinc, iodine, B vitamins. I don't think rice is a problem. Look at females in Asia. Their main source of calories was rice for many decades and you don't see there fat females or males with estrogen dominance.. I think that high iodine is a huge factor here.. It helps metabolize estradiol to less strong forms of estrogen which can be easily detoxed from the body.. Also birth control pills are huge problem in western world for females. It creates estrogen dominance and all the problems from it very fast..
Quote from Jiří on January 1, 2024, 12:55 am@janelle525 what is her diet. The liver needs good amount of choline, protein, some fiber.. Also thyroid regulates liver function. Low thyroid function = low bile production and flow.. So iodine, selenium also very important.. Also high estrogen(estrogen dominance) is very common in females and that also creates cholestasis.. For that you need also protein, zinc, iodine, B vitamins. I don't think rice is a problem. Look at females in Asia. Their main source of calories was rice for many decades and you don't see there fat females or males with estrogen dominance.. I think that high iodine is a huge factor here.. It helps metabolize estradiol to less strong forms of estrogen which can be easily detoxed from the body.. Also birth control pills are huge problem in western world for females. It creates estrogen dominance and all the problems from it very fast..
Yeah I don't think rice by itself clogs the liver, unless you just don't digest starch well at all. Garrett Smith says he never felt well on rice. Asians digest the form of starch in rice very fast. Leaving little for microbes to eat.
I'm not sure what my Mom's diet is, she definitely avoids protein because she can't digest it, has been on strong acid reflux meds ever since she got her gallbladder out a decade ago. I don't avoid meat and I struggle with reflux at times. Last night I had steak with a baked potato, took enzymes and betaine HCL with it, we decided to celebrate new years with sparkling apple cider about an hour after dinner. Bad mistake I can't drink anything after dinner but a sip of water before bed in the winter or I will be up with nausea at 3 am. We both have weak digestion it seems. She has been treated with T4 since she was like 27. I think she doesn't convert enough of it to T3 because of the liver issues. I think my thyroid works well it's the liver that gets clogged up with hormones and stuff like you said. Estrogen is definitely a factor. I'm cautious with iodine though. At least supplemental.
@el,
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If I was cured, I went on a diet with rice, beans and meat for a year and I had a lot of fatigue, pain, fever. I stopped taking beans and. rice. In a month I got better and I'm better than I've ever been in my life. about a kilo a day. of pears and oranges and green tea sparkling water and lemon. My liver enzymes have improved greatly in a month. beans made my liver enzymes worse
"
That is awesome, so happy for you! I dont eat rice, I have tried but I dont really like how it makes me feel. Probably my genetics are not so adapted to it being Nordic. Do you eat meat too? Or only the foods above? Because that would make you a fruitarian, sort of...?
You are in Spain, no? Because then I can totally believe a diet of oranges and pears could be helpful as they grow in your region and you have strong sun.
Quote from Frank on December 31, 2023, 1:35 pmDid you stop coffee and start beans at same time? Did you try carnivore with no coffee? Sounds like you dont know sure that it is beans that help you and not stopping coffee or something else at same time. You say some things get worst when eating beans too like dry skin?
@frank-2 I stopped coffee a few days after starting the beans last winter. Because I got this weird pressure headache in the back of my head, when I started eating beans. I dont have headaches. It was really odd, and I decided to try quit coffee. The headaches never came back. It was the combo of coffee and beans that made my head ache. Now, many months later, I get no head aches if I take a cup of coffee, which I have done maybe 10 times the last year. I use coffee now only for emergency medicine. Not daily or weekly.
I did not get drier skin from eating beans really, I already had dry skin on my lower legs. Except yes I did get a bit dry skin on my fore arms this fall. That is new. I am not sure why, it might be because I have cheated quite a bit.. with sugar etc.. So much family gatherings this fall and now again Christmas holidays, it has been rough. So glad it is over now and i can return to clean eating.
@janelle525 I don't know why asians would digest rice any better than people from different places. Rice is simply starch and all humans can split the chains of glucose from starch to glucose.. White rice is simply easy to digest very low in fiber. So obviously you will not feed bacteria with it. Btw do you realize that "acid reflux" is from low stomach acid not from high stomach acid and by taking anti acids you are making sure that your stomach acid will be even less acidic and you will not digest anything? You and your mom need to do the opposite to increase stomach acid with lemon juice/apple cider vinegar before meals.. Anyway so exactly like I said issues with estrogen dominance, low thyroid which means low bile production which means low or no detox.. I don't know why are you "cautious" about iodine. Do some reading how long and how big doses were used for all kinds of things. People are taking 50-100mg and more with no issues. People who feel sick from couple of mg of iodine are full of toxins and garbage and they feel detox reaction, but thy blame iodine for it.. Btw don't forget that iodine is not needed only for thyroid function and to metabolize estrogen. It is also needed for stomach acid production.. In your case and in case of your mom it is crazy to not take iodine at least in mg doses. Start low and slow 1mg for week after that 2 mg for a week etc.. Up to I would say 10-20mg is perfectly safe. Just take 200mcg of selenomethionine with it.. Females who have serious issues with estrogen dominace and are running low in iodine are in huge risk developing very aggressive types of estrogenic cancers. Like breast, ovaries etc.. For males same thing mainly prostate cancer.. My grandpa and father both had prostate cancer and they saw iodine maybe on the picture and they had issues detoxing estrogen.. I am 100% sure that if I am not taking iodine in some effective dose which means in miligrams not micrograms. I will end up like them for sure.. Look at Japan females who ate traditional diet. All slim ladies with zero estrogen issues even when they eat a lot of estrogenic soy. Why.. Because their iodine intake is in miligrams..
Quote from Jiří on January 1, 2024, 10:42 am@janelle525 I don't know why asians would digest rice any better than people from different places. Rice is simply starch and all humans can split the chains of glucose from starch to glucose.. White rice is simply easy to digest very low in fiber. So obviously you will not feed bacteria with it. Btw do you realize that "acid reflux" is from low stomach acid not from high stomach acid and by taking anti acids you are making sure that your stomach acid will be even less acidic and you will not digest anything? You and your mom need to do the opposite to increase stomach acid with lemon juice/apple cider vinegar before meals.. Anyway so exactly like I said issues with estrogen dominance, low thyroid which means low bile production which means low or no detox.. I don't know why are you "cautious" about iodine. Do some reading how long and how big doses were used for all kinds of things. People are taking 50-100mg and more with no issues. People who feel sick from couple of mg of iodine are full of toxins and garbage and they feel detox reaction, but thy blame iodine for it.. Btw don't forget that iodine is not needed only for thyroid function and to metabolize estrogen. It is also needed for stomach acid production.. In your case and in case of your mom it is crazy to not take iodine at least in mg doses. Start low and slow 1mg for week after that 2 mg for a week etc.. Up to I would say 10-20mg is perfectly safe. Just take 200mcg of selenomethionine with it.. Females who have serious issues with estrogen dominace and are running low in iodine are in huge risk developing very aggressive types of estrogenic cancers. Like breast, ovaries etc.. For males same thing mainly prostate cancer.. My grandpa and father both had prostate cancer and they saw iodine maybe on the picture and they had issues detoxing estrogen.. I am 100% sure that if I am not taking iodine in some effective dose which means in miligrams not micrograms. I will end up like them for sure.. Look at Japan females who ate traditional diet. All slim ladies with zero estrogen issues even when they eat a lot of estrogenic soy. Why.. Because their iodine intake is in miligrams..
I'm unsure how you came to the conclusion I don't understand stomach acid. I said I took betaine HCl with my steak meal last night. It's my Mom who can't get off acid blockers, I've tried helping her get off them, she even took an acid test where she had to be off them and it showed she had fairly high amounts of acid. I'm thinking it was the rebound effect from being off the blockers, it had only been a few days. I didn't want to end up like her so I usually try to maximize my digestion. I've been taking the betaine hcl for several months now, usually only one or two with meat meals because otherwise I get a discomfort in my stomach if I take too much.
There are different kinds of rice, short grain and long grain. I was talking to an Asian on the raypeatforum many yrs ago discuss the amylose types in rice. He claimed he has perfect digestion of I believe short grain but I could be forgetting. Some cultures also have more copies of a gene for digesting starch. Some have less amylase in their saliva as well. In general I do think rice is pretty easy to digest, but I feel fine on wheat because that's what my family has been eating for hundreds of yrs. White rice seems more capable of dropping blood glucose since it does digest so quickly. Anyway, just mentioning some things to show the complexity of the topic!
I am very well read on estrogen but iodine is only ever recommended in very remote health circles. I haven't seen any proof as of yet. Ray Peat was like an expert on estrogen and he recommended against iodine supplementation. How do you know Japan doesn't deal with too much estrogen? Only due to their size?
This paper looked at estrogen positive tumors of Japenese women and their incidence rates, they found it is increasing among premenopausal women and that low birth rates and breastfeeding might be a factor: https://www.annalsofoncology.org/article/S0923-7534(19)38476-5/fulltext
So it appears iodine consumption has little to do with estrogen positive breast cancer. I can't say if it protects them from other cancers. I have no cancer in my family despite low seafood consumption and living far away from the ocean. My Grandma had 10 children plus a stillbirth and miscarriages. She is still alive at 90. Her only issue was heart disease and some dementia now in her old age. She was pretty fat and loved to eat animal fats. Very little seafood. It appears having children protects women against cancer!
@janelle525 I was talking about traditional Japan. So like 50+ years ago not now. Today the world is globalized and everybody eats the same garbage.. My grandma was also pretty fit in her 90s and her intake of iodine also wasn't that high. But she also did not took birth control pills and wasn't exposed to estrogen like chemicals from plastic and all kinds of things. You are talking about Ray Peat. Go on Ray Peat forum and read some topic about iodine. Plenty of good info. Recently I was reading there about a guy who gave his wife iodine and it cured her breast cancer. How I know that Japan females had no issues with estrogen dominance? Yeah it is mostly about body fat and fat distribution. You can see on a female if she has really good or really bad hormonal profile. It is obvious. Same for males. When you see male with pear like shape body, with gynecomastia, big ass and hips and small shoulders, skinny jello like arms without any muscle definition you know 100% this male doesn't have ideal DHT, estrogen levels.. I would say more than 50% of males today are like this. It is just horrible how degenerate people today are if they are eating and doing mainstream stuff...
Quote from Jiří on January 1, 2024, 2:20 pm@janelle525 I was talking about traditional Japan. So like 50+ years ago not now. Today the world is globalized and everybody eats the same garbage.. My grandma was also pretty fit in her 90s and her intake of iodine also wasn't that high. But she also did not took birth control pills and wasn't exposed to estrogen like chemicals from plastic and all kinds of things. You are talking about Ray Peat. Go on Ray Peat forum and read some topic about iodine. Plenty of good info. Recently I was reading there about a guy who gave his wife iodine and it cured her breast cancer. How I know that Japan females had no issues with estrogen dominance? Yeah it is mostly about body fat and fat distribution. You can see on a female if she has really good or really bad hormonal profile. It is obvious. Same for males. When you see male with pear like shape body, with gynecomastia, big ass and hips and small shoulders, skinny jello like arms without any muscle definition you know 100% this male doesn't have ideal DHT, estrogen levels.. I would say more than 50% of males today are like this. It is just horrible how degenerate people today are if they are eating and doing mainstream stuff...
My Grandma was very large in the bosom and belly still no cancer, but she did have a heart blockage 10 yrs ago. I'm not overweight and I still have had issues with estrogen clogging up my liver. I'd say Japan is going downhill due to adopting more western style diet but also because they refuse to have children. They still do probably eat way more seafood than Americans. Yes I've read some good stories on iodine, and I'm not against it altogether, I'd just like to see more study on it before adopting it as a cancer cure. There are many so called cancer cures out there that I wouldn't try for myself or loved ones. Heck we radiate and chemically kill cancers!! Many things kill cancer cells including retinoic acid, but does it mean it's good for general use? When something makes me feel toxic I stop doing it, so if I took iodine and it made me feel toxic I wouldn't keep doing it.
Quote from Inger on January 1, 2024, 10:28 am@el,
"
If I was cured, I went on a diet with rice, beans and meat for a year and I had a lot of fatigue, pain, fever. I stopped taking beans and. rice. In a month I got better and I'm better than I've ever been in my life. about a kilo a day. of pears and oranges and green tea sparkling water and lemon. My liver enzymes have improved greatly in a month. beans made my liver enzymes worse"
That is awesome, so happy for you! I dont eat rice, I have tried but I dont really like how it makes me feel. Probably my genetics are not so adapted to it being Nordic. Do you eat meat too? Or only the foods above? Because that would make you a fruitarian, sort of...?
You are in Spain, no? Because then I can totally believe a diet of oranges and pears could be helpful as they grow in your region and you have strong sun.
I eat a lot of meat