@alexm "DUDE" 😀 I tried for bile flow EVERYTHING. From all kinds of toxic bitter herbs to ox bile. I had like 5 bottles of ox bile from jarrow. Did nothing. Btw If it can dilute bile that is all I need to start detoxing... But like I said I think I had perfect bile flow in Croatia away from this fucking place where I live. This year I will move somewhere else so will se if that helps.  

Quote from Jiří on January 30, 2024, 7:11 am

@alexm "DUDE" 😀 I tried for bile flow EVERYTHING. From all kinds of toxic bitter herbs to ox bile. I had like 5 bottles of ox bile from jarrow. Did nothing. Btw If it can dilute bile that is all I need to start detoxing... But like I said I think I had perfect bile flow in Croatia away from this fucking place where I live. This year I will move somewhere else so will se if that helps.  

It was the jarrow bile acid factors supplement?

@alexm yes

@jiri Personally I think its just something in the food you're eating or something your exposed to at home that is inhibiting your bile.

Quote from AlexM on January 30, 2024, 8:33 am

@jiri Personally I think its just something in the food you're eating or something your exposed to at home that is inhibiting your bile.

It could be trauma. Did you guys know, that trauma inhibits bile flow/liver function....

Jiri has talked about family stressors (this would be trauma for sure) and i can say from own experience, it is true the trauma makes you not be able to deeply relax. This impacts the liver.

@inger yeah I felt in different country so good because I knew that nobody there knows me lol..

@joe Interesting comment under youtube video about how to increase testosterone

"Useful info. An update on Zinc - Zinc should be balanced with Copper, even better is to take a balanced mineral formula. Zinc taken on a regular or long term basis can cause a low Copper situation Copper situation which can lead to Iron overload or Disregulation. I suffered with low Copper after 2 years of regular Zinc supplementation and had to be treated in hospital ..the symptoms i had were multiple - anemia, low body temperature, bone pain , low white blood cell count, irregular heartbeat, loss of pigment from the skin, and thyroid problems..I also had grey hair and aged wrinking of my skin due to Iron Overload which spread to my internal orgnans..hospital tests showed almost zero Copper and excess Iron build up in internal organs..after stopping Zinc and taking 2 mg Copper daily all symptoms were gone and after several months I had restored health...a reciprocal relationship between iron and copper has been established in some tissues. For example,  iron accumulates during copper deficiency...Zinc bisglyconate is advised as it has a high absorption rate, I find that Magnesium Glycinate is an excellent supplement 👌 . A quality Pycnogenol and or Ginkgo Biloba is useful too .."

and on the question how much he was taking

"just a couple years ,around 5 days a week or more I would take anywhere from 15 mg and some days 45 mg"

THere you have it. The guy was taking basically like 30mg a day on average which is considered very safe dose and even Smith is saying that this dose which is the same dose as in his supplement can be taken without testing. If someone is eating red meat daily + taking even small dose like 10-15mg of zinc let a lone if the person takes molybdenum as well. Which is maybe even stronger copper antagonists than zinc. This person can run into serious issues with low copper. I think we will see a lot of cases like that from group of people who just blindly follow Smith and his advice.. 

@alexm I acknowledge your experience. But I really can't take as an argument what Dr.Smith said. He said a lot of stupid things. For example that copper is just toxic metal not essential for our body. How dangerous is that to push BS like that on people.. Once someone ends up with aneurysm or stroke because copper deficiency caused collagen breakdown will he use that case in his videos as testimony? I don't think so.. To me Dr.Smith is equivalent of Morley Robbins now. I just can't take him seriously..

How long has it been since Grant took in more copper?  

Grant is not taking copper antagonists like zinc and molybdenum on daily basis. BIG difference.. His diet of red meat and rice with beans is actually pretty balanced in terms of zinc/copper intake and ratio. But Smith is pushing his supps which is combination of copper antagonists. Many people who follow him have no idea what is their copper status and take them daily. That can cause issues over time.. 

Btw I watched ALL his streams on youtube from the time he started his youtube until recently. It goes back years and years So you can't be more wrong about what I know about Smith.. At this point he just keeps repeating and insures himself with info that is convenient and useful for his business and protocol that he established. There is zero confrontation with different ideas in fact he keeps repeating that everyone who is not his YES man will be just deleted..  

Then get on his livestream this Tuesday morning at 11am CST and pose a question on his superchat for $10 or whatever.  As long as your question is not intended to attack or stir up hornets he will address it.  Asking about copper is a good question.  Considering how pervasively copper is ingested, absorbed and stored by our system, I still lean in Doc's favor.  Copper deficiency is as unlikely as retinoid deficiency.  

Garrett cites points like copper content in cancers.

Copper [Cu] is toxic & accumulates in the liver, causing disease. It's quite straightforward. Note how Cu levels were higher in LIVER CANCER TISSUE

Hepatic copper accumulates in ferrets with & without hepatobiliary diseasehttps://t.co/NkcgSYHUad
"Centrilobular Cu accumulated...

— Nutrition Detective 🔍 - Dr. Garrett Smith (@NutriDetect) September 11, 2022

(9) Nutrition Detective 🔍 - Dr. Garrett Smith on X: "Copper [Cu] is toxic & accumulates in the liver, causing disease. It's quite straightforward. Note how Cu levels were higher in LIVER CANCER TISSUE Hepatic copper accumulates in ferrets with & without hepatobiliary disease https://t.co/NkcgSYHUad "Centrilobular Cu accumulated..." / X (twitter.com)

It is a valid argument.  Whether or not it is final nail in evidentiary coffin, it is impossible evidence to dismiss.  Especially considering the crazy amounts of copper we all absorb from our environment.  

This video is about 40 weeks old so probably outdated.  Just the same he raises points that are unwise to dismiss.

Love Your Liver Livestream 90_ All Channel Subscriber Q&A! #vitaminadetox #copperdetox (rumble.com)

This is not dismissing the concept of copper as a nutrient. It is acknowledging the idea and prioritizing bets on future choices.  These arguments head in the same direction as eating eggs (vitamin A rich food) in the process of trying to detox and deplete vitamin A levels.  Sounds like junkies logic.  

And yeh, I was the kid decades ago who willingly argued with cigarette smokers who were convinced that A) "I can stop anytime I want" and B) "smoking is good for me."

Good on you for listening to his livestreams.  I am more prone to read.  Hence I read his chats and studies cited and or read his twitter threads.  His articles on the LYL network are valuable but they are behind a paywall.  

Got insulin resistance? Dump this compound for better health…https://t.co/rCWEtUJheM

— Nutrition Detective 🔍 - Dr. Garrett Smith (@NutriDetect) August 14, 2022

(10) Nutrition Detective 🔍 - Dr. Garrett Smith on X: "Got insulin resistance? Dump this compound for better health… https://t.co/rCWEtUJheM" / X (twitter.com)

Fertility as an indicator as overall health is another wise angle to consider.  Why is it that IUD's are made of copper?  Are we seeing women come up copper deficient after years of birth control?

Not sure what the term is for relieving toxicity symptoms by taking in more of the toxin that caused the symptoms.  The fact that drinking alcohol relieves delerium tremens is hardly an indicator that alcohol is a nutrient.  I know someone right now with horrific itching burning rashes (almost certainly eczema) on lower legs that steroid creams are no longer helping.  He is getting great relief with vA and vD creams.  Are you going to argue that he is not damaging his liver further from this?  Do you think he is making his problems worse or better long term.  Completely understandable at this point.  He needs to sleep and cannot without it.  If he does come around to address toxicities, not sure if he will be able to break his habit and detox without wrecking himself worse.

I suggest you look here at an archive of articles searched for copper that is not behind a paywall. 

https://nutritionrestored.com/blog-forum/search/?keywords=copper

So far your most convincing article that copper is a nutrient is that you think Garrett Smith is a dangerous fool.  That argument in itself is curious to see on this blog.  Considering Garrett's and Grant's regard for each other and their efforts, successes and logic, it stretches credibility.  One is either in agreement that vA is a toxin or it is not.  If the belief is that it is a toxin, then it needs to come out and not be taken in.  If one believes otherwise, then it is pointless to be here.  The same seems to apply to copper.  

Try this.  Get on LYL livestream on youtube this Tuesday at 11am CST and send a superchat asking how long Garrett and as many clients as he can list have been eating a copper deficient diet and following a copper depleting diet. Instead of arguing, ask him questions that give him a chance to show merits and or weaknesses in the premise.  He has more than five years working with this concept.  His results do speak well of the concept.  Have you contradictory results on a similar timeline and scale?

Quote from lil chick on January 26, 2024, 6:38 am

Super interested to find that pellagra (niacin deficiency) can result in Malar rash, which is something I tend toward.    

 

I know of zero people, myself included, who are not using junkies logic on some item today.  We all do it.  I think it is a survival mechanism exactly the same as the liver grabs and stores retinols as fast as it can. 

Meanwhile, Kelsey Kenney has a few of us trying topical nicotinic acid (NA) spray.  Easy to make.  If I drop my junkie's logic that keeps me typing here long enough, I will go mix up a batch and try it.  And yeh, I have been warned it brings the flush as well.  Given the articles I have seen on NA enemas curing ulcerative colitis that was previously treatment resistant, I will be surprised if it does not improve the integrity of every membrane NA touches.  Impressive studies on rats and humans.